candyman

I have not seen an E-cig with any short of shut-off device. When they first came out I saw a ton of backing for them at the stores they have in the city...but that died off quickly and when I did my report on smoking I got ALOT of negative feedback from people. Most complaints I hear from people are that you tend to feel sick after continued use which I would take to be a bad sign. You do not have to overdose on nicotine for it to be a bad thing. Everything is a poison at certain levels. And my point still stand with the nicotine, the flavors, and the kids. I understand that it is "better" than real cigarettes but still... I don't really like these things but I guess I will reserve judgement until later. However I still stand by one of the laws that is stamped into my head and its revolves around the idea that almost EVERYTHING that we consider bad today or that we are banning was at one point found to be "good" or was considered "safe" and in some cases was considered "healthy"...we are in a constant cycle of stupidity which really isn't our fault at all. CFC's are in our atmosphere today because at one point we found them to be "inert" so we were so very sure that they would cause no problems...and while I do not believe in the whole global warming game they got going on I do know the science behind the CFC's and it ain't good...but they WERE "good" and were tossed around like a cheap whore until we got wiser.

They should not be able to fine the establishment if proper warnings are given...sounds like a good excuse for making money there...if the bar lets the people smoke then I guess the workers don't really care for the ban which defeats the whole argument for worker protection in that bar... I am damn sure going to step outside with my beer too. It is my purchase and I am going to protect my beer from theft of tempering which people even attempt when you are right next to your beer anyways. And yeah I will probably end up blowing smoke in the faces of a few people. However I will use discretion which is something you don't often hear of like deciding to blanket all establishments under regulations that don't apply to them all. If you talk shit to me about the ban while walking in the least you should expect is smoke in the face for acting like a bitch...ramp up the shit talking if you must but remember that I brought my beer out with me and I only drink from bottles or mugs which REALLY HURT when they make contact with your skull. Other people that will have smoke blown at them are people that smell like BO, the dumped a whole bottle of cologne/perfume on themselves, and drunk people because drunk people need not worry about lung cancer...I couldn't smell you people when the bar had smoke in it or when I could chase you away with my could so now I will give you a bath BEFORE you go in so you don't torture the bar tenders or the patrons. Remember that it doesn't matter which side you are on DO NOT act like a dick because that will start shit. If you act like a dick expect the other person to act like a dick...and you are in a bar so there might be a fight. In bars Karma like to take shape in the form of fists, beer bottles, beer mugs, pool cues, billiard balls, bar stools, beer signs, neon signs, belts, toilet seats (only saw that one time though), full cans of beer, and sometimes steel toe boots. Sore losers are bad but sore winners are worse...act like a dick to smokers if you want but the ban can only protect you from smoke and not the beatdown that you encourage when you act like a retarded dick.

Well considering the product is NOT approved by any sort of national or international agency the regulates products to make sure that they are safe I would take that as a bad sign since it has been out for purchase for a very long time. On a similar note, the FDA and other agencies national and international have all been sending out warnings about this product relating to the chemicals it contains...chemicals that cause cancer, chemicals that poison various systems in your body, and basically most of the chemicals contained in REAL cigarettes and the worse part is that these chemicals are in LARGER doses. Why are they in larger doses? Well, mostly because the filters used represent at least the same quantity of nicotine in one pack of cigarettes which includes the chemicals that go with it. Also...we are trying to get kids to stop smoking right? The big thing that hooks them is nicotine right? They banned flavored cigarettes to stop kids from being tempted right? UH OH! These things come in many flavors and contain unknown dosages of nicotine because who the fuck is going to trust the manufacturer when it comes to dosage on the labels? So...if people are cool with this shit what the fuck was wrong with cigarettes? Considering how much more nasty cigarettes taste kids are less likely to continues use as long as the nicotine hasn't gotten them yet...AND at least you can't OD on nicotine with one cigarette! These things may only let off water vapor...the they still smell like rancid pig shit to me!

I have been to the Heart Attack grill once...they did not sell cigarettes of any kind nor did they have Jolt or whatever that is...they just don't have diet soda. Best...fucking...burgers...EVER!

Wait Michigan is keeping its cigar bars? Damn...lucky bastards...our cigar bars are getting closed up yet they are leaving the hookah bars up for some weirds reason...but even at the hookah bar you have to step outside if you want a cigarette! I cannot even understand why cigar bars are even an issue...its a single purpose place which means it deals exclusively in tobacco...if you hate smoking and either work there or go in there on occasion you must be a relative of the pet rock...

Oh boy now he is going to try to convert you! Please oh please do NOT let this spark a thread where we show off our pets in clothing...Tiggs would kill me!

I have just never like the people in NY and I think this is why. Every other city has a mix of people ranging from assholes to very nice people...NY just has a bunch of assholes that you can't understand...

Fuck the E-cigarette! None of the different brands or versions of that shit are approved by anyone nor is anything in them regulated. Yes they DO contain carcinogens. No the nicotine is not regulated therefore dosage is unknown...not a risk I want to take with nicotine. They come in different flavors...something banned in cigarettes because of the appeal to kids...yay more kids addicted to nicotine! The only real studies done on the E-cigarettes have been done by the FDA and other associated groups...THE SAME people that put down cigarettes and started the bans rolling...

So what sort of fine system is Michigan getting then? In Wisconsin they are not going to fine the bars at all as long as proper warnings are posted they are just going to fine the person in violation of the law. If Michigan has the same regulations concerning fines its easy to get around it. Most bars here will sell you ashtrays from about 3-4 bucks a piece. The money gets placed into a pool to help pay your fines should you get busted. The pools at most bars are getting quite large because enforcement has been a big problem for the local authorities to say the least...but thats what happens when you up the CFM of the ventilation fans enough to pull someones pants off. As long as the owner and workers or the bar along with its regulars make a stand the people that tend to piss and moan get the picture after a while...but since they really only show up one night a week for a single fruity mixed drink who cares? At least I can still smoke in my car...but they want to change that. At least I can still dictate how much salt is in the food I eat...but they want to change that too. Well at least I can make decisions on building materials and methods for my home as long as they meet codes...oh fuck they changed that already! See? The great snowball has started rolling and is going to eat you all!!!!!

No you pretty much can't prevent shit like this from happening unless you took humans out of the picture which won't happen...and even if humans aren't on a drilling platform they will still find ways to die or become injured. Its called an "accident" or "human error" for a reason...nothing is to blame here except for the fact that we are animals and we all fuck up. People can blame "Big Oil" for this all they want...but that is a bunch of bullshit finger pointing that does not belong if we want to consider ourselves the least bit civilized. From what I know of industrial procedures and standards the one thing that could be a factor are the hours that these guys work which the Unions so kindly got for them after many lawsuits...the very hours that wear them thin and provide the extra push towards an accident...but it is still an ACCIDENT!

The ban isn't even enforced in Wisconsin yet and they are already changing it. Now as long as there are two walls with open windows in the room you can smoke there. Funny thing is my town just had a big protest against the ban led by the owners and workers of the bars...the very people the ban is supposed to protect. I could really care less if there were some provisions made and some of the rules were less moronic. 25 feet away from most buildings is not only in the road, it overlaps with the 25 foot rule on the other side of the road. Also, if lawmakers made provisions for places that still wanted smoking like, oh, private clubs where patrons and owners asked for it. With it being warm out I don't really care that much as long as I can take my beer out with me which I WILL do...but winter is gonna suck...anti-smokers can kiss my ass and walk through the smoke its not going to kill you.

So...we have advanced our race so much with the Ipad that we can no longer sit without aid from some device? Holy fuck! You must have to be insanely stupid or have no control over your body to not be capable of sitting on the ground by yourself holding a very small and light device so that you can see it properly.

Oh man I don't know how many times there have been small bar fights because one drunken idiot gets mad when people tell him he stinks...and that is just the BO that people can smell over the cigarette smoke. I just hope they start to burn incense or alot of candles at the bars pretty soon when my smoke won't sheild my nostrils... The lesson learned here is that smelly people that don't have a good reason for it are violent...not just the BO people but the ones that wear a TON of alcohol based scents...

THAT all depends on the culture you live in and the state of things in that area. There are areas in the middle east where this is not an evil...it is how things are run. I am by no means calling them animals or that they are wrong its just how shit works there. Money, land, property, and blood are the currency of this world...we just go about them in different ways.

Good point...but we could ramp up the banter and keep this going for months! Wouldn't that be fun?

Actually I was kinda going back to the OP and added a few things from the general discussion...which gave me a headache when I tried to read only the stuff that mattered but still. She supports measures that could slowly heal hunting methods in Alaska instead of a brute attack on them that won't work and will divide the people. Hunting from planes up there has a reason, look it up, and is actually more humane than what the local tribes call hunting...they hide sharp blades in a chunk of whale fat so when the wolf tried to eat it the blades cut up its mouth and its bleeds out leaving them a trail of blood to the body.

But that is all perception right? I am just confused here because her votes and stances deal with issues in Alaska where the environment is much different that what we have around here. The wolf hunting is a good example since it deals with an issue that is there and not here. Considering the fact that she tries he best to work with the local tribes and the people I would probably put her on the fence when it comes to the environment. Its not as easy as it sounds and even trying you best can backfire and you end up with egg on your face. You know they do have quite a few shows where a former addict or criminal teaches people about safety or how to deal with the issues...with what I have under my belt I could surely host a fire safety show just watch what I do and do the opposite!

If you are going to do it don't bitch when others do it too...

I wasn't really responding only to you I was really just making a statement. Notice I did not respond to one of your posts or quote you there.

Both those guys are pretty much the same as far as providing the news...they just have different styles when it come to presenting it. They are both slanted but in a good way...they slant in any direction they want and use that to poke fun at everyone. You get the news and you get a laught...doesn't get any better than that.

I think that maybe on this show they could highlight the wolf hunting and such and explain WHY it is done for people that do not understand these things. The show could also show how the hunting is done in Alaska...and then they could show how it is done over in Russia and a few other countries...oh wait that would support why people in Alaska do this... I don't care who the host is there are still going to be groups that say the host is too friendly with the environment and groups that say the host in not friendly enough with the environment. It all has to to with the watcher and how "good" they think they are when it comes to the environment. Shit, I know a few people living off the grid in Minnesota and even though they live off the land many of the "environmentalists" would think that they are not friendly with the environement. Just give here a chance...I personally would love to see most of the other politicians, on both sides, handle being outdoors for more than a few minutes. And no being against her is not sexist unless you include sexist phrases in you statements.

You seem to be under the impression that there is a set list of things that you must support and be against to be an environmentalist. Just to let you know...there is not otherwise a TON of people I know that are really into this whole "green" movement thing would be anti-environmentalist even though they are really far from it. You are taking a few things she supports and are tossing out the other things that could make all the difference. Have you ever dealt with wolves in your area? Even here is Wisconsin they provide a huge problem with herd management. I only know a few people in Alaska but from what they tell me wolves have a long way to go before we come close to wiping them out. Polar bears...while they are few the scientific community is still split down the middle when it comes to how they are supposed to be in terms of numbers and population areas. So you can't really put her down until there is a firm decision that states which side is correct. It can be argued that their habitat is shrinking...however a good sized portion of their habitat is solid land which as far as I know does not shrink regardless of the global temperature. I am really not trying to bash you here. I generally don't pay attention to environmental stuff like this however since I went to college in Madison for 4 years the majority of my teachers were hardcore environmentalists and much to my surprise they all argued over these points and many others. They stated that things are not well and that something should be done about it...but they also stated that many of the "facts" out there are filled with bullshit that muddles the truth which is tearing apart the scientific community and the general community. So in short its likely that like most people considered anti-environmentalist that she really isn't...there are just different ways to go about doing it and none of them are wrong...they just aren't how you would do it. How do you expect people to work together to help the planet if the mentality that we have now stays the same?

I am being totally serious here but I think that Colbert Report and John Stewart do it the best. They poke fun at the people that need it but they also turn it around and hit the other side with some mud. Yes it is on Comedy central and is sort of a joke but what they give you along with some investigation of your own leads to a fairly good and somewhat unbiased knowledge base. Honestly the comedy hitting both sides is why I like it. I have had many professors let us those shows as examples in class so they have some credit...

I love how the last paragraph in your post paints nature driven companies, aka corporations, as pro-environmentalists as if thats what they really are. Now maybe people will begin to realize just what its all about. Fuck trees...they want money! Yeah they are "green" in a way but the only reason they give a shit about fuzzy animals and mist covered valleys is that it rakes in cash. Team up with Palin? Hell yeah! Not only will the show rake in the normal piles of cash...they now have Palin which means more people will watch which includes both the people that love her and hate her! And I don't get how she is anti-environmentalist when her stances either put her on the same side, using different means, or close to the same side as Obama...oh wait that is right even if you agree that changes should be made you are totally wrong and evil if you propose different ways to go about doing it even though we are not sure who is right. Why do I love this show? Ummm...because I love watching and hearing the complete bitch fest that comes from anyone that is against her...is there nothing else to do for some of these people? If you can't change the channel when her show is on just go take a long poop or get out a book in another room...