A question

[Homicidalheathen]

Do you think you can permanently damage your brain chemicals with long term drug use?

I mean, the chemicals not just killing a few cells. Or the chemical reactions.

[Homicidalheathen]

Note at the bottom is says 'may recover'

http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/bb/neuro/neuro04/web2/agao.html

[The Rod]

This is currently a huge area of debate in the neurological community. For the longest time it was thought that neurons could not repair themselves, but recent evidence has shown that in some cases they actually do.

As for the chemicals, what usually happens is that the drugs become a substitute for certain chemicals in the brain, making the ones that your brain creates useless. After you quit using the drug the brain still expects that chemical, and without getting that drug it slowly over time rises back toward a normal level of chemical release. Typically the brain never reaches the level it was at prior to the drug use though. Looking at this acutely, you'll notice it as the depressive withdrawal after the high has receded. The drug became the substitute for that (typically excitatory) chemical, and when it was taken away the brain goes into a downward spiral. Stretch that out over years, with a more gradual increase, and you have a general idea of what it does chemically to your body.

btw, the physical damages caused by the drugs can also influence the chemical changes. If these drugs were to injure or kill neurons important in the creation of the chemicals (or in broadcasting the need thereof), this of course could make the situation worse than it already is.

[Steven]

from a former chemical headcase: yes.

some people come back from it and are perfectly functional.

some people dont.

Dont know why. I've actually seen more long term damage in people who used less than those of us with bigger appetites.

[Soulrev]

This is currently a huge area of debate in the neurological community.  For the longest time it was thought that neurons could not repair themselves, but recent evidence has shown that in some cases they actually do.

As for the chemicals, what usually happens is that the drugs become a substitute for certain chemicals in the brain, making the ones that your brain creates useless.  After you quit using the drug the brain still expects that chemical, and without getting that drug it slowly over time rises back toward a normal level of chemical release.  Typically the brain never reaches the level it was at prior to the drug use though.  Looking at this acutely, you'll notice it as the depressive withdrawal after the high has receded.  The drug became the substitute for that (typically excitatory) chemical, and when it was taken away the brain goes into a downward spiral.  Stretch that out over years, with a more gradual increase, and you have a general idea of what it does chemically to your body.

btw, the physical damages caused by the drugs can also influence the chemical changes.  If these drugs were to injure or kill neurons important in the creation of the chemicals (or in broadcasting the need thereof), this of course could make the situation worse than it already is.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can relate to this in my own experiences.. When I quit smoking pot I became very angry for the first 3 or 4 days after not smoking. Not really angry I guess, but I definitely felt like I could kill someone with my bare hands.. Probably because pot made me very laid back and relaxed and after doing it so heavily for so long I couldn't be happy for a few days after using it. But I knew I had to stop and all those "symptoms" went away after a few days of not using it anymore, drinking water, and taking b-12 vitamins.

[Soulrev]

also I have never used meth and never will. That shit is in my opinion the absolute worst of the worst drugs out there. I've met several people who used to use it and you can tell. Seeing how those people have been fucked up in the head after using it is enough to scare me the fuck away from that shit.

[Homicidalheathen]

I think it took me a yr for my brain to 'heal'. I don't think it did anything permanent.....I was already sorta wierd lol

But yah, I have seen people who don't seem to recover, I just wondered if it was more that they sorta burned out too many brain cells and maybe gave up on themselves but it makes sense, what if you damage cells that create the chemicals or guide the chemical reactions? Seems like at some point it is going to do permanent damage.

[honeymustard02]

I think it depends on the drug.

Now I know two meth users. One of which was a lite user I guess and one who is a much heavier user.

Now the light user has been clean since Nov and I'm still seeing some problems. Just attention to detail type things.

Now the heavy user shows all the signs of brain damage. Too many to mention really.

But I think in my personal experience it does cause damage with heavy drugs.

Now pot. That honestly makes you stupid, but once you've been off it for a while, it clears out and you're back to normal.

[Homicidalheathen]

I used to do Meth. I can see where it might mess up one's brain for good in the long run if you did it for yrs and yrs.

Like make you unpredictable emotionally....unsensible...

and yes, pot makes you stupid but it's not permanent. I know because I quit twice to attend college and was ok after I had quit for awhile, but honestly.....even just smoking a bit on the weekends brought my grades down so I had to quit during that time totally yah. It does effect short term memory and makes studying and retaining a bitch.

[honeymustard02]

The people I know have been on meth for years. One for 5 yrs and another for about 11yrs. So yeah that's long enough to do some mega damage.

[Steven]

I think it took me a yr for my brain to 'heal'.  I don't think it did anything permanent.....I was already sorta wierd lol

But yah, I have seen people who don't seem to recover, I just wondered if it was more that they sorta burned out too many brain cells and maybe gave up on themselves but it makes sense, what if you damage cells that create the chemicals or guide the chemical reactions?  Seems like at some point it is going to do permanent damage.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

this is so right on the mark.

I too was a meth fiend (you know this HH).

It cost me alot.

relationally, financially, spiritually, etc. Had to have my my nose rebuilt in a non cosmetic rhynoplsty because of it.

but it took me a good year, at least, to get the sketch out of me, and to start mentally connecting the dots to the point where I coul dhalfway effectively think on my feet. That shit is so full of various toxins that it's no wonder it does such damage.