To be Baptized or not to be Baptized?

[Rivet_HeadINC]

Don't ask me where this is coming from, but it just kinda poped in to my head and I wonder.

When my wife had her Baby Shower for our Son, we had registered for a lot of things that had not religious conotations. See, we a re both Pagen (She is Celtic and I am Satanic/Wiccan/Celtic:don't ask unless you want a long explination :grin: ) and we do not believe in the Christian god.

My mother and father who raised me an my three siblings Catholic, bought us a baby book that had Noah's Ark on it and in the book was a section about Baptisim.

My question is for anyone who has been baptised what has it done for you? I was baptised and I feel asleep in church.

[phee]

Nothing what-so-ever as far as I can see, then again, I have lived my whole life baptized, so I really can not give you an explination as to what it has done for me, as I have never lived my life as "unbaptized" to have a comparison....don't you just love talking to us agnostics?

[Rivet_HeadINC]

hey, I understand. I was Baptised and I don't get it at all. It has done nothing for me what so ever.

[bav]

Well, it depends if you're talking about what it does for you in a religious or a worldly sense?

Iffin yer not planning on raising the kid in a flavor of religion that requires baptism, then I wouldn't worry about the religious sense.

On the other hand, here in the world.....baptism might go a long way with preventing problems with the grandparents if they are pushing for it, provided you don't have any overwhelming objections about it.

Of course this is all coming from the sun-worshipping atheistic Jew, so I've never had to really think about baptisms.

[LuthienTheFallen]

i wasnt baptised and i dont plan on having my children done either

[gothicmom]

Our faith doesn't believe in infant baptism. In fact, baptism isn't what gets you to heaven it's an act of obedience and shows your willingness to follow God. thats what I grew up learning.

[Rivet_HeadINC]

Wow, never thought that I would get such a response on this topic. Everything that has been said helps. I guess you all share the same views as I do.

I think it's pointless and I just wanted to know if there was anyone out there who supported it and if so why.

Thank you all so far.

[Ginevra]

I think Bav has a point, though with the grandparents of the child. If YOU don't feel that it will hurt/help anything, why not let the little one have an infant baptism to placate the grandparents? YOU know how you're going to raise the child and it won't be in the way that the grandparents want. Let them have a small moment of "peace", so to speak, and have done with it.

But I'm sure, though, that down the road there will be more instances of this sort of the thing as the child grows. Such as Grandpa and Grandma wanting to take the little tyke to Sunday school with them. This actually might not be a bad thing in its own way as it exposes the child to other cultural influences. Whatever the child is taught at home is typically what they align themselves most closely with. </tangent>

[Onyx]

I think Bav has a point, though with the grandparents of the child.  If YOU don't feel that it will hurt/help anything, why not let the little one have an infant baptism to placate the grandparents?  YOU know how you're going to raise the child and it won't be in the way that the grandparents want.  Let them have a small moment of "peace", so to speak, and have done with it.

But I'm sure, though, that down the road there will be more instances of this sort of the thing as the child grows.  Such as Grandpa and Grandma wanting to take the little tyke to Sunday school with them.  This actually might not be a bad thing in its own way as it exposes the child to other cultural influences.  Whatever the child is taught at home is typically what they align themselves most closely with.  </tangent>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree with Bav and Ginevra.

Different cultural influences can enrich a child's life, and if you don't feel strongly about it one way or another it could go a long way in promoting family harmony.

As the child's parents the final decision should be yours though.

[Rivet_HeadINC]

This is awesome, I'm getting so much from all of you and it's helping out a lot. I guess it's just the fact that this is our first and I'm so scared that somewhere down the road I'm going to screw up and regret it.

Granted, Baptisim is just a tiny chunk of the gargantuan Ice Berg my wife and I are going to face in thenext week or so, but are my feelings normal? :ermm:

[Onyx]

This is awesome, I'm getting so much from all of you and it's helping out a lot.  I guess it's just the fact that this is our first and I'm so scared that somewhere down the road I'm going to screw up and regret it.

Granted, Baptisim is just a tiny chunk of the gargantuan Ice Berg my wife and I are going to face in thenext week or so, but are my feelings normal?    :ermm:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Because you are human beings, you will likely screw up here and there and will likely regret it, but the fact that you ARE worried about it and carefully considering how to raise your child means you will make good parents. Who wants perfect parents anyway -- can you imagine the pressure on a child to have to live up to that?

It's the parents who are indifferent who end up alienating their children. It sounds like you are going to do fine.

[Rivet_HeadINC]

Thank you very much. It helps to have an outside source who believes that my wife and I will do okay. We get it from our parents, but that's a given correct?

[Fierce Critter]

I"m currently a non-denominational Pagan with leanings toward the ancient Polish paganism - no pantheon, kinda Druidic in it's belief in the divinity of nature, dual-faith in that it allows for the co-existance of certain aspects of Christianity without the dogma.

But I was raised Catholic, and to me, not being baptised meant that should you die, you would go to limbo - a place somewhere between purgatory & Heaven.

I don't believe in those "levels of afterlife" anymore. I also don't know where baptism falls in other religions as far as importance. For Catholics, it's damned high up there.

Not necessarily an answer to your question, but perhaps something that might give you food for thought: when my brother-in-law's brother and wife had a kid, they weren't regular attendees at a certain church, and the Catholics can get REAL political about who they'll baptize, particularly when you don't belong to a particular parish. After a lot of BS & run-arounds, they said to hell with it and baptised Windy themselves. The church would probably say it's not valid, but in my eyes, it was the perfect thing to do - eliminate the earthbound middleman (the church) and go right to the source - God.

Perhaps you could arrange a non-denominational baptism ceremony at a Universalist church?

[torn asunder]

you can't "screw up" if you believe, at the time, your decision is right. hindsight is pointless, as what's past is past. make the best decisions you can at the time, and move on...

[Brenda Starrr]

I'm an ordained non-denominational minister (bet you all didn't know that), and even I don't see where it's necessary. As long as what you are doing is right, you're going to get to wherever you want to be in the end. Does that make sense? I don't feel as though you should placate the grandparents if you feel strongly about not baptizing/christening. This is your child, not theirs. It's not going to change how they feel about the baby. Even though I'm Christian, I strongly believe in freedom of religion. My way is not the only way....

My mother doesn't believe in Hell. She believes that we're in Hell right now, and that all of this is a test of some sort. She didn't appreciate having to have my sister and I christened. My grandparents on my dad's side pushed that one, as they were Catholic. Whoever/whatever you believe in will not persecute you for not having some water sprinkled on your infant. I've made many mistakes in my life, and I don't think some Holy Water would save me. My faith will.

[JaneDead]

good points/post brenda

[Brenda Starrr]

Thank you.

[TomCat]

All other things aside, about the warm fuzzies, your "standing in the religious community" or what have you; Baptism is a Christian belief based sacrament, rite, act. Understanding Christianity, and paring it down to the brass tacks, you don't have to do anything to go to heaven anyway.

The answer to all things Chritian-like/Holy? It's right there in the Bible. Christ died for our (man's) sins. All you gotta do is live, and die. Anything that helps you sleep better at night is gravy.

[Rivet_HeadINC]

How very true that is TomCat. See like I said in the begining, my wife is a Celtic Pagan and I myself, am a Satanist/Celtic Pagan. I don't see the point in the pomp and circumstance that is involved in Baptisim and neither does my wife.

Our gods will except our son for who and what he is, and should the time come that he chooses to believe in the Christian god and be baptised then all power to him. By that time it will be a decision that he made for himself and not something that was forced on him like it was me.

I think I have all that I need and I thank you all for all of the advice and pointers you have give, you all have been more that helpful and it's nice to know that I have people out there (some whom I never met face to face) that I can turn to to help me with things like this.

You all are like a family to me. I can't believe that I stopped posting when I did.

[paradox]

go wit yer beliefs. why baptize if ya dont believe?

my own situation was thus, my daughter being my mothers 1st grandchild and all (i dont recommend being the 1st, if you can help it...at least not with my mom...). i was raised roman catholic. not a beliver and dont practice. if anything, im all about bushido, but thats another story and not really a religion so much as a philosophy. my wife was formerly christian but her family converted to islam way early in her life (she black and native american, if that helps explain anything. probably not). theres also a pretty strong witchcraft influence with her mom and aunts from back in the 60s-70s. at any rate, yea, shes non-practicing. so that leaves us with alot of choices. i want to raise my daughter to appreciate all beliefs and, should she feel she needs to, pick one (or more). so id like her to get a taste of it all. but we dicided not to force her into one, so no baptisim (though i have a sneaking suspicion grandma went behind our backs on this...).

so whats the point of all that? well, exactly! :grin: whats the point? whatever floats the boat. dont feel pressured by outside forces. theres enough of that crap nowadays anyway. you should feel comfortable raising yer child as you like. no one else should have an issue with that.

[Marblez]

My mother was christian, raised to believe that children are born without sin. She believed that the rite of infant baptism was unnecesary as children are pure anyway. She and my father (christian - raised catholic) decided to raise us christian but not catholic. It was their choice.

My father's family, however, very catholic.

My mothers 3rd child died of Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS) at only a few months old. It haunted my mother after my grandmother accused her of allowing my brother's soul to be sent to purgatory. A rift was caused in the family for a while after that. It wasn't until a few years ago when my mother became ill and extremely devout in her beliefs that she overcame the ill feelings about the choices she had made with regards to baptizing him.

My personal belief is that a person should be baptized if/when they feel that the time is appropriate. If they themselves are ready to dedicate their lives to the Lord and the christian faith. I do not feel that it is a necessary step to get into heaven and obviously this is not a choice that an infant can make.

For some reason, guided by the bible and armed with holy water, I was compelled to perform a baptism of sorts on my mother the night before she died. This brought her great comfort, I could tell.

Anyway, I think that you need to really think about a situation such as this. Discuss it with your wife and with the grandparents. Discuss with them your concerns. It is not a choice to be taken lightly and remember the old adage - "It takes a village to raise a child". If you expect to count on them to assist with the child, their concerns should be at the least considered in matters of the greatest significance to them.

[paradox]

you know, all this batizim talk makes me think of the baptisim scene in 'Eric the Viking'... :grin:

[DisturbedMania]

I personally would have appreciated not being baptized as a baby and would have truely appreciated not being forced into confirmation (Catholic thing) later in childhood.

[Shade Everdark]

I honestly don't mind, looking back, having the somewhat laissez-faire Christian upbringing that I did. If nothing else, I at least have some knowledge of the Christian faith and church, and how they operate.

And it provides some unique insight into the differences between the denominations.

Experience is the best teacher, they say.

[Rivet_HeadINC]

I agree with you Shade, experience is the best teacher. My wife and I have decided that we are not going to have our son Baptised.

I had a very strong Catholic upbringing and in a way, I feel that that is the reason I turned out the way I am today, and I wish (sometimes) that I wasn't as bitter as I am about it.

My son will have the best life I can possible give him. His faith will be based on what my wife and I believe in, until he can make his own decision to believe what he wants to.