7 Things....

[uggae]

1: i'm 15 years old, ca. 187 high, weigh 75.5 kg, long brown hair, punk/goth/black metaller, damn sexy(lol hackzXD)

2: my interests: computing, music, philosophy, chilling with the m8s:)

3: politics: i'm a cross between a anarchist and a socialist:)

4: religion: i am a lavey satanist:)

5: is a real friend and a shoulder to both lean and cry on:) so come forth

6: have some kind of antisocial thing(not confirmed by any means, but who needs a painter to see the wall is red?) which means that i sometimes can't be in a room with a lot of ppl in it, because i get confused and stressed.

7: I HATE GOBLINS!!!!

[pomba gira]

1. Being cold-cocked by True Love at the beginning of this year was the most frightening experience I've had in a long time.

2. I have a dent in my right thigh where the bumper of a van hit me at 40 mph.

3. I make PERFECT tempura squid.

4. I'm really, really glad I had my tubes tied at age 24.

5. I'm trying very hard not to judge people's intelligence by their writing skills.

6. For some reason calling friends on the phone is very hard for me. I don't mind talking on the phone but I'm always convinced the person I'm calling has way better things to do than talk to me.

7. Since going off Prozac a couple weeks ago, I'm starting to understand the major extent to which it's been fucking with my head for the past few months. It's like I can feel my brain chemistry normalizing itself day by day.

[kellygrrrrrl]

1: I like to smell things.... Everything has to be sniffed before I go forth.

2: I am always changing my mind. I cannot seem to keep on track with anything. As soon as I conclude, my mind changes again. I am forever changing. Everything changes, and Nothing stays the same....

3: I am obsessed with hair. I shoulda been a "Salonist"...lol....

4: I have recently developed a strange love for country music. Seems like I can relate to a lot of the lyrics and just sooths my soul.

5: I LOVE the outdoors...something I've recently discovered and seemed to have forgotten over the years. I yearn for the quiet peacful country living although that will probably never be.

6: I am in the process of a major self discovery. I caught myself in a big circle of my own hangups that I plan on removing from my life as time goes on and permits me to do so.

7: I am very quiet for the most part until you get to know me.

[torn asunder]

7 things, huh!? hmmm...

1) i golf

2) i communicate/commune with trees, and can feel different "personalities" between species.

3) i think animals are smarter than people - ** find a home, find some food, be yourself, always have some play time!**

4) i *think* i can sing, but i'm too shy to really pursue it like i think i should.

5) i get frustrated easily by my lack of proficiency with anything i'm trying to learn.

6) i've worn eyeliner and nail polish, while bar-hopping in leathers on my motorcycle

7) i'm a BIG flirt, (sometimes inadvertantly/unintentionally) and i don't consider kissing/making out to be cheating.

[SuZQZ]

1. Married once, been divorced for 8 yrs and have one daughter.
2. I'm uncomfortable being the center of attention (unless the attention is from a special someone). I would rather be in a supporting role instead of center stage.
3. I shaved my head in high school to make it absolutely clear to my classmates that I was not conforming to their cookie-cutterness. Very Borg like when I look back on them! Resistance turned out to not be futile.
4. I put up a very tough outer shell to hide the fact that I'm really very emotional and can be hurt easily.
5. It's important to me to do a good job at whatever I'm doing, need that feeling of having succeeded.
6. I was a drama club nerd in high school. It's where I learned how to hold my liquor!
7. I love to cook, especially on the weekends when I can take my time and really put a lot of thought and energy in to it. Not as fun on the week days after work. I always feel rushed.

[Head Wreck]

i was an avid reader, and finished the home library off by time i was four.

i'm increadibly clumbsy

i was walking by 7 months old

i am studying a rare martial art that includes healing and meditation

i was going to join the army after collage

my family is tracable back to a welsh prince

i have visited detroit once, and turned up to city club once just as i was sobering up from a wedding

[the eternal]

NOW ME

1. I rarely come on here unless I'm feeling overwhelmed and/or depressed.

2. Although I'm very friendly, I choose to keep few friends, because most people let you down.

3. I'm going through a major life change right now, and although I'm excited, I'm scared.

How do you suddenly move forward when you've only known one way for your entire adult life?

I'm in the middle of two paths and those paths sometimes feel like walls closing in from both sides.

4. I'm extremely naked. Not only am I an open book, I come with highlights, cliff notes and a 37-page index.

Even though this flaw has lead me to get ripped apart more often than a flayed dear carcass in the middle of a murder of crows,

I wouldn't know how to act differently if I tried.

5. I used to worry that being bisexual would repel women when I told them, but I've come to realize, the exact kind of women I'm interested in are the same ones who find bisexual men sexy.

6. No matter what others say---

(for example--Bean insists "the ladies" found me to be quite a saucy dish at the Red Apple a few months back )

inside I will ALWAYS be the awkward 12 yr old kid who couldn't attract a fly if he was covered in horseshit.

AND FINALLY

7. I have a unique appeal that seems to repel most people, but garner extreme loyalty among the few.

I would make a good cult leader.

My members?

Bigger women with large breasts 5' - 5'5" tall .

Don't ask me why.

I haven't quite figured it out yet.

[Scales]

Good topic.

1. I am not a spiritual person anymore, just a humanist and an atheist. I have experimented and studied with religions/spirituality, I just don't openly talk about it. However, one of the most important things to me in life is seeking out the indescribable feeling of magic/mysticism; not just love, but the source of the imagination, dreams, and enigmas, I love seeing that untapped/being a part of it.

2. I have completely made-up, cinematic moments going through my head, which is pretty much the basis for my music and photography. I began seeing how I was going to look years ago before I had ever even purchased any alternative type clothing, and everything has been evolving from there.

3. I have been through past trauma, suicidal depression, social anxiety, and a 510 ml DXM death trip. I know too many people who've had it worse.

4. One of my grandma's died when I was young, one of my grandpa's survived Cancer, one of my uncle's has been paralyzed head to toe for life since high school, another uncle who was a genious took his life because drugs messed him up, my other grandma had a stroke and hasn't been the same since, a cousin I never met died in the war in Iraq, and my dad's a complete two-faced asshole (imo).

5. I follow my own path, I believe I'm intelligent, but I don't believe in the world. I almost channel my affection into my intelligence, which makes me seem cold and distant. I come off ultimately mysterious to a lot of people (even the ones I'm closest with), I've given up trying to figure myself out to the extent I could reverse it, I just accept it as the way I am.

6. I am extremely aware, analytical, and understanding of human behaviour; not that I have by any means perfect control over my own. I find enough things in the world corrupt that I can't fully accept it. I think the world should be more affectionate and intelligent, but all I see are broken systems, unlimited stigma, and mindless dogma.

7. I value experience, inner strength, and knowledge, and I don't stray away from any question; I try to stay completely blunt and honest with myself to stay strong and avoid self-deceit, regardless of how it effects my emotionally in the short term.

That's all I got.

[FarrIL]

I was born 15 days late. Waiting one day more would've made my birthday the Irish Holiday.

I'm a Pisces but plenty of aspects of me pertain to the fiery ram.

I almost got held back in 1st grade due to my attention span.

My first kiss was in 10th grade.

Both my dad and grandmother are into Geneology but my dad goes through Scottish clans and he's traced us back to the Bernett family.

My hair wouldnt pick a colour when I was a baby, so it changed itself a lot.

Due to how petite, skinny and pale I was in 4th grade, my teacher gave me a note on the first day of school to give to my mother, asking if there was something 'wrong' with me. Teacher insisted I needed growth hormones because of my stature.

[Homicidalheathen]

I love this thread.

[Daniel]

1) I am a serious fucking Atheist, though I practice Zen. I could probably be considered a secular Buddhist, if such a thing exists. I like Buddhism as a practice without the mythology, Bodhisattvas, etc. However, I do not believe in any sort of God any more than I believe in the Toothfairy or a teapot floating around Mars. I am, in fact, the sort of Atheist that thinks monotheism and the Abrahamic religions are the cause of ten times as much suffering as they are healing. I'm also the type of Atheist that thinks "Agnostics" are simply pussy fence-sitting Atheists.

2) I express myself through music. In my mind, I am always building a soundtrack for every situation I encounter. Sometimes I shit out my own compositions this way. Other times, it is how I build mix discs. Other times, it never manifests as anything.

3) I love obscurity, though not for the sake of obscurity. All of my tastes, be it movies, books, music or whatever, tend to be on the far out edge. This is sort of by accident and sort of by design. I suppose this is how I got roped into the various subcultures to begin with.

4) I practice Ving Tsun kung fu. I have many, many years of martial arts experience. Some 4 or 5 doing kung fu, and I also boxed for 7 years during and around my high school years. These are not counting other minor excursions with other martial arts like wrestling, karate, and a few others.

5) I do not drink, smoke or do any kind of drugs. I abstain from eating meat, but I hate being called a vegetarian. I do not do these things for ethical reasons.

6) I plan to, at some point later in life, spend some time isolated as per Thoreau at Walden Pond. Maybe for as little as a year, but for at least a significant amount of time. All this assuming I do not run into serious health problems between now and then.

7) I lean left, politically. There was a time when I was somewhat moderated and I enjoyed the right wing/left wing balance, but this Bush/Neocon/Moral Majority shit has become so out of control, I feel myself violently retaliating against it. I appreciated right wing fiscal responsibility philosophies when they were real, but the Republican party has become so fixated on this Moral Majority / religiously motivated agendas that I simply cannot tolerate it any capacity anymore. In fact, the Bush administration is the least fiscally responsible administration ever. I'd suggest replacing them with Libertarians, but they tend to be idealistic nut jobs. Of course, with some work, Libertarians would be a good replacement for the Republicans. At least they seem to be secular. I feel strongly about health care reform (I am 100% behind universal health coverage), and copy right reform (works should return to the public domain as soon as possible, I personally say in 12 to 15 years, versus lifetime+).

[Steven]

1) I do, see, experience, and express all things from a common root of following after Jesus Christ, a man who I find quite amazing given what he pulled off in such a short timespan with literally no education, military might, or financial reserves and have yet to see a comperable pre or post modern example of any singular man's impact on this planet in comperable circumstances. Plus I beleive he's God because I'm feeble minded that way.

2) I love red meat, good beer, good scotch, good friends, good belly laughs, and a good fart. All of these things bring me tremendous pleasure in their simplicty and purity.

3) I beleive life in general can be summerized quite nicely with just a few choice simple questions or ancedotes such as...."whom then shall I fear?" or "who do you serve?" or "where is the mustard?"

4) I live what I beleive at every living moment and I do not vascillate, back up, re-neg, or question who I am or why I am here or weigh it against the common grain. I also do not sell it. if you know me long enough you'll know that about me. That stance has cost me a great deal including family relationships and yet its taught me a great deal and opened up doors of surrogacy that have yeilded incredible moments of clarity and purpose.

5) I love my friends with tremendous depth and expect the same in return which is very probably completely unrealistic and yet it tends to create itself within those relationships nonetheless.

6) I respect experience, but loath watching smart people live stupid lives.

7) I once gave a girl I hardly knew, my kidney. She still has it. We know each other now. But that experience led to many others like it and that was the start of my downward spiral into the conviction that this life is meant for more than just you.

[Daniel]

5. I'm trying very hard not to judge people's intelligence by their writing skills.

Conversely, I make it a point to judge people by their writing skills. It seems a perfectly reasonable way in which to gauge someone's intelligence. When someone has the time to consider their words and they write carelessly and poorly anyway, why should I assume they are intelligent? If you asked me, the lack of self-respect demonstrated in their poor writing would indicate they agree with the assessment. At the very least, the sloppy writer does not mind being seen as unintelligent, in which case I will indulge them by maintaining that conclusion. I find occasional mistakes and typos to be normal and reasonable, particularly when made in an informal setting like a message board, but only if it seems that person is at least making an effort to write presentably.

Concluding that someone is intelligent because they write well also seems reasonable to me.

[Steven]

Conversely, I make it a point to judge people by their writing skills. It seems a perfectly reasonable way in which to gauge someone's intelligence. When someone has the time to consider their words and they write carelessly and poorly anyway, why should I assume they are intelligent? If you asked me, the lack of self-respect demonstrated in their poor writing would indicate they agree with the assessment. At the very least, the sloppy writer does not mind being seen as unintelligent, in which case I will indulge them by maintaining that conclusion. I find occasional mistakes and typos to be normal and reasonable, particularly when made in an informal setting like a message board, but only if it seems that person is at least making an effort to write presentably.

Concluding that someone is intelligent because they write well also seems reasonable to me.

unless of course they are not really asking you....

or worse, they simply have a different way of measuring the intrinsic value in another person because thier morals, experiences, processing, surroundings, social circle et al are not yours and have led them in another direction....

then there is the off chance that they simply don't care because their particular modes of expression are meant to satisfy themselves first.

Or even worse, they may write in a completley unintelligent manner (based on your particular worldview) and yet are still able to carry on reciprical conversations because other likewise unintelligent people respond to it and or even enjoy it.

that is why I've deliberately chosen to judge a man by his shoes, its much more accurate...

[savageminstrel]

1) I have been a single dad for 15 years. Raised my daughter pretty much on my own...and am still single.

2) I am a musician with eclectic tastes...play bagpipes and guitar, as well as a few other minor instruments...I like Skinny Puppy, Nine Inch nails, as well as traditional irish and scottish music..... pretty much anything and everything as long as the message is positive.

3) I was raised Catholic, but have assimilated a lot of different religions into my belief system. I now consider myself a "Gnostic Christian/Neo-Druid/Buddhist"....... if that makes any sense. I think that every religion on the planet is just another perspective of the same "god".

4) I almost died from drugs a few years ago...and in the time since I have learned a lot about myself, and what I expect from others.

5) I am a Capricorn/Horse (western and chinese astrology)

6) I have played and worked at the Michigan Renaissance Festival for the last 12 years.

7) I hope to move to Ireland within a year or so, my mum was born there and I am already an irish citizen, and I was offered a job there as an electrician, which is what i did before I retired from Delphi (Not because I wanted to) and I hope to play music for a living.

[pomba gira]

Conversely, I make it a point to judge people by their writing skills. It seems a perfectly reasonable way in which to gauge someone's intelligence. When someone has the time to consider their words and they write carelessly and poorly anyway, why should I assume they are intelligent? If you asked me, the lack of self-respect demonstrated in their poor writing would indicate they agree with the assessment. At the very least, the sloppy writer does not mind being seen as unintelligent, in which case I will indulge them by maintaining that conclusion. I find occasional mistakes and typos to be normal and reasonable, particularly when made in an informal setting like a message board, but only if it seems that person is at least making an effort to write presentably.

Concluding that someone is intelligent because they write well also seems reasonable to me.

It may be justified to assume that good writing skills are a sign of intelligence. But not to assume that poor writing skills are a sign of low intelligence.

Some people are very intelligent but verbal skills are just not their talent. There are also many people who are dyslexic or have learning "disabilities" who are quite intelligent but find it nearly impossible to express themselves in writing. Written English is so unnecessarily complicated, with so many counterintuitive rules... in most cases proper spelling and grammar don't really add anything to communication. After all, you know what they meant, or you wouldn't be able to recognize an error, right? So it ends up being a barrier to "real" learning, and just another way for people to look down on each other and focus on the unimportant.

I am quite rigorous in teaching grammar and spelling... because (a) the content standards say the kids have to know them, and (b) I know they ARE going to be judged on these things. But it truly seems like a colossal waste of time. I wish we could just revamp the whole written English language to make more sense... or at least go back to the pre-19th c. system of orthography, where spelling was a form of individual expression.

I highly recommend doing some reading on multiple intelligences, for an understanding of how we very unfairly value certain types of intelligence more than others. It's interesting stuff.

[Daniel]

unless of course they are not really asking you....

Similar to how I was not really asking you, but you responded anyway. Your response is one of the many possible and predicted results of my posting something in this public forum. Note the similarity to how my judgment is one of the possible effects of someone posting a poorly written diatribe for public consumption. They were not really asking me, but, they made my conclusion a possibility by presenting it in that forum.

then there is the off chance that they simply don't care...

Obviously. Which is why I do not mind judging them this way. They don't care, and I don't mind! =) Concluding that poor writers are less intelligent than excellent writers is completely effortless on my part, similarly to their not caring. I cannot imagine why anyone would complain.

Or even worse, they may write in a completley unintelligent manner (based on your particular worldview) and yet are still able to carry on reciprical conversations because other likewise unintelligent people respond to it and or even enjoy it.

Indeed! Which means my opinion should not matter to them, and these unintelligent people are encouraged to continue on with their unintelligent activities. I completely approve. It usually makes for funny stories for me to tell other people at a later date anyway.

Which, by the way, writing poorly is not evaluated in some subjective "based on your particular Weltanschauung" sort of way. There are objective standards that have been in place for some time. No one is under any obligation to adhere to them. I would not even dream of suggesting that. Properness is simply a matter of establish protocol which is unnecessary for communication. That's part of what is so brilliant about language. Any mouth breathing idiot can string together a chain of words and communicate basic ideas. "GORG EAT NOW, YUMMY FOOD", is a perfectly comprehensive statement. However, the manner in which one communicates reflects a lot of things about that person, whether it is fair or not. Anyone speaking like Gorg on a regular basis is not likely to command a lot of respect, even if that person wears sensible shoes. If, for whatever reason, someone wants to throw all conventions out the window, people will in general make judgments based on that, fair or not. Conversely, the more refined one's ability to communicate is, the more effectively one can exchange or elaborate on complicated ideas. For some people, being lazy and writing sloppy is more important than simply taking a moment for the sake of clarity and mutual intelligibility. I see nothing abhorrently wrong with this, but I also see nothing wrong with evaluating that person as unintelligent.

By the way, calling a conversation reciprical (sic) is redundant. All conversations are by their nature reciprocal, unless you are talking to yourself. In that case, it is not really a conversation. I mean, look at the way the word breaks down: The root "con" means "together". "Vers" is "to take turns". Meaning, we take turns talking together. The reciprocal activity is implied in the meaning of the word. Your sentence would mean exactly the same thing without the reciprical (sic).

in most cases proper spelling and grammar don't really add anything to communication.

Absolutely agreed. Properness is simply what separates "high language" from "common language" and serves no real function.

After all, you know what they meant, or you wouldn't be able to recognize an error, right?

This I do not agree with. Simple errors and typos are one thing, and do not significantly impact the value of the communication. For eaxlpme you can raed tihs eevn tohguh it is spleeld all fkceud up. Sticking perfectly to grammar is similarly worthless. However, continuous disregard for structure and coherency causes constant and exponentially increasing misunderstandings. I often find that it is sufficient for someone to simply TRY to fix at least the glaring obvious errors. If they take their time, correct obvious misspellings and grammatical problems, it generally adds significant gvalue to the communication. Even with a minor learning disabilities (like dyslexia or ADHD), some people can communicate fine.

In fact, a lot of people with certain disabilities communicate better than these lazy chat room/message board people simply because they make a genuine effort. In the days of spell check (I love you Firefox), there is no excuse for dozens of typos per post, yet you see obvious and unexcused misspellings in nearly every thread of this forum.

I highly recommend doing some reading on multiple intelligences, for an understanding of how we very unfairly value certain types of intelligence more than others. It's interesting stuff.

I understand these concepts in great depth. Usual judgments get thrown out for justified cases. However, people simply too lazy to write coherently when they are fully capable are not taken into consideration.

[Daniel]

*deleted for redundancy.

[Shade Everdark]

1) I am a serious fucking Atheist, though I practice Zen. I could probably be considered a secular Buddhist, if such a thing exists. I like Buddhism as a practice without the mythology, Bodhisattvas, etc. However, I do not believe in any sort of God any more than I believe in the Toothfairy or a teapot floating around Mars. I am, in fact, the sort of Atheist that thinks monotheism and the Abrahamic religions are the cause of ten times as much suffering as they are healing. I'm also the type of Atheist that thinks "Agnostics" are simply pussy fence-sitting Atheists.

2) I express myself through music. In my mind, I am always building a soundtrack for every situation I encounter. Sometimes I shit out my own compositions this way. Other times, it is how I build mix discs. Other times, it never manifests as anything.

3) I love obscurity, though not for the sake of obscurity. All of my tastes, be it movies, books, music or whatever, tend to be on the far out edge. This is sort of by accident and sort of by design. I suppose this is how I got roped into the various subcultures to begin with.

4) I practice Ving Tsun kung fu. I have many, many years of martial arts experience. Some 4 or 5 doing kung fu, and I also boxed for 7 years during and around my high school years. These are not counting other minor excursions with other martial arts like wrestling, karate, and a few others.

5) I do not drink, smoke or do any kind of drugs. I abstain from eating meat, but I hate being called a vegetarian. I do not do these things for ethical reasons.

6) I plan to, at some point later in life, spend some time isolated as per Thoreau at Walden Pond. Maybe for as little as a year, but for at least a significant amount of time. All this assuming I do not run into serious health problems between now and then.

7) I lean left, politically. There was a time when I was somewhat moderated and I enjoyed the right wing/left wing balance, but this Bush/Neocon/Moral Majority shit has become so out of control, I feel myself violently retaliating against it. I appreciated right wing fiscal responsibility philosophies when they were real, but the Republican party has become so fixated on this Moral Majority / religiously motivated agendas that I simply cannot tolerate it any capacity anymore. In fact, the Bush administration is the least fiscally responsible administration ever. I'd suggest replacing them with Libertarians, but they tend to be idealistic nut jobs. Of course, with some work, Libertarians would be a good replacement for the Republicans. At least they seem to be secular. I feel strongly about health care reform (I am 100% behind universal health coverage), and copy right reform (works should return to the public domain as soon as possible, I personally say in 12 to 15 years, versus lifetime+).

You do realize that it's possible for someone to be an agnostic atheist, right? While one might make the argument that there is some overlap between the two, agnosticism concerns itself with knowledge about deities, whereas atheism concerns itself only with belief in them.

[Homicidalheathen]

Your a fasinating man, can't wait to talk to you in person!

1) I have been a single dad for 15 years. Raised my daughter pretty much on my own...and am still single.

2) I am a musician with eclectic tastes...play bagpipes and guitar, as well as a few other minor instruments...I like Skinny Puppy, Nine Inch nails, as well as traditional irish and scottish music..... pretty much anything and everything as long as the message is positive.

3) I was raised Catholic, but have assimilated a lot of different religions into my belief system. I now consider myself a "Gnostic Christian/Neo-Druid/Buddhist"....... if that makes any sense. I think that every religion on the planet is just another perspective of the same "god".

4) I almost died from drugs a few years ago...and in the time since I have learned a lot about myself, and what I expect from others.

5) I am a Capricorn/Horse (western and chinese astrology)

6) I have played and worked at the Michigan Renaissance Festival for the last 12 years.

7) I hope to move to Ireland within a year or so, my mum was born there and I am already an irish citizen, and I was offered a job there as an electrician, which is what i did before I retired from Delphi (Not because I wanted to) and I hope to play music for a living.

[Steven]

Similar to how I was not really asking you, but you responded anyway. Your response is one of the many possible and predicted results of my posting something in this public forum. Note the similarity to how my judgment is one of the possible effects of someone posting a poorly written diatribe for public consumption. They were not really asking me, but, they made my conclusion a possibility by presenting it in that forum.

Obviously. Which is why I do not mind judging them this way. They don't care, and I don't mind! =) Concluding that poor writers are less intelligent than excellent writers is completely effortless on my part, similarly to their not caring. I cannot imagine why anyone would complain.

Indeed! Which means my opinion should not matter to them, and these unintelligent people are encouraged to continue on with their unintelligent activities. I completely approve. It usually makes for funny stories for me to tell other people at a later date anyway.

Which, by the way, writing poorly is not evaluated in some subjective "based on your particular Weltanschauung" sort of way. There are objective standards that have been in place for some time. No one is under any obligation to adhere to them. I would not even dream of suggesting that. Properness is simply a matter of establish protocol which is unnecessary for communication. That's part of what is so brilliant about language. Any mouth breathing idiot can string together a chain of words and communicate basic ideas. "GORG EAT NOW, YUMMY FOOD", is a perfectly comprehensive statement. However, the manner in which one communicates reflects a lot of things about that person, whether it is fair or not. Anyone speaking like Gorg on a regular basis is not likely to command a lot of respect, even if that person wears sensible shoes. If, for whatever reason, someone wants to throw all conventions out the window, people will in general make judgments based on that, fair or not. Conversely, the more refined one's ability to communicate is, the more effectively one can exchange or elaborate on complicated ideas. For some people, being lazy and writing sloppy is more important than simply taking a moment for the sake of clarity and mutual intelligibility. I see nothing abhorrently wrong with this, but I also see nothing wrong with evaluating that person as unintelligent.

By the way, calling a conversation reciprical (sic) is redundant. All conversations are by their nature reciprocal, unless you are talking to yourself. In that case, it is not really a conversation. I mean, look at the way the word breaks down: The root "con" means "together". "Vers" is "to take turns". Meaning, we take turns talking together. The reciprocal activity is implied in the meaning of the word. Your sentence would mean exactly the same thing without the reciprical (sic).

Absolutely agreed. Properness is simply what separates "high language" from "common language" and serves no real function.

This I do not agree with. Simple errors and typos are one thing, and do not significantly impact the value of the communication. For eaxlpme you can raed tihs eevn tohguh it is spleeld all fkceud up. Sticking perfectly to grammar is similarly worthless. However, continuous disregard for structure and coherency causes constant and exponentially increasing misunderstandings. I often find that it is sufficient for someone to simply TRY to fix at least the glaring obvious errors. If they take their time, correct obvious misspellings and grammatical problems, it generally adds significant gvalue to the communication. Even with a minor learning disabilities (like dyslexia or ADHD), some people can communicate fine.

In fact, a lot of people with certain disabilities communicate better than these lazy chat room/message board people simply because they make a genuine effort. In the days of spell check (I love you Firefox), there is no excuse for dozens of typos per post, yet you see obvious and unexcused misspellings in nearly every thread of this forum.

I understand these concepts in great depth. Usual judgments get thrown out for justified cases. However, people simply too lazy to write coherently when they are fully capable are not taken into consideration.

wow.

well that was a very colorful and succinct "sez you."

two things to roll your eyes at:

A) by reciprical I simply mean involved. Mutually. with earnst. meaning there is some intentional back and forth that is rooted in some degree of respect or interest. such as the conversationalists involved actaully enjoying their banter and finding themselves really wanting to know what the other person thinks and why. Thats what I mean by reciprical.

B: something about you dude, seems to reallllllly want to be acknowledged as being perhaps just a cut above, as if you've truly earned the recognition you so deserve. That redundency you speak of, I get that same taste in the lengths you go to to say "nah unh".

in fairness however, this opening line that you used was a winner and I had to chuckle even at my own expense: "Similar to how I was not really asking you, but you responded anyway....." (good one)

[Steven]

It may be justified to assume that good writing skills are a sign of intelligence. But not to assume that poor writing skills are a sign of low intelligence.

Some people are very intelligent but verbal skills are just not their talent. There are also many people who are dyslexic or have learning "disabilities" who are quite intelligent but find it nearly impossible to express themselves in writing. Written English is so unnecessarily complicated, with so many counterintuitive rules... in most cases proper spelling and grammar don't really add anything to communication. After all, you know what they meant, or you wouldn't be able to recognize an error, right? So it ends up being a barrier to "real" learning, and just another way for people to look down on each other and focus on the unimportant.

I am quite rigorous in teaching grammar and spelling... because (a) the content standards say the kids have to know them, and (b) I know they ARE going to be judged on these things. But it truly seems like a colossal waste of time. I wish we could just revamp the whole written English language to make more sense... or at least go back to the pre-19th c. system of orthography, where spelling was a form of individual expression.

I highly recommend doing some reading on multiple intelligences, for an understanding of how we very unfairly value certain types of intelligence more than others. It's interesting stuff.

ahhhhhhhh Pomba, I kiss you deeply......

[Steven]

You do realize that it's possible for someone to be an agnostic atheist, right? While one might make the argument that there is some overlap between the two, agnosticism concerns itself with knowledge about deities, whereas atheism concerns itself only with belief in them.

I'm starting to get the feeling that we're all being told to "know your role...." ya know Shade?

[creatureofthenyte]

I'm 32.

I'm comfortable in my own skin, it took many years for me to achieve this.

I think that if one person is more intelligent then another,

that does Not,

make the more intelligent person,

better then the less intelligent person; Nobody's perfect.

I am a good person,

I treat people the way I like to be treated,

unless they give me reason not to.

I am a gemini,

I can see two different sides to one thought or situation,

simultaneously.

This sometimes causes me to put alittle extra thought into things then I normally do, which is good, but also frustrating at times.

I am an open book,

and easy to get to know,

and Im not shy about voicing my thoughts; in cases where it applies,

if I have to choose between being honest with someone or hurting their feelings,

I usually choose to be honest cuz that's how I like to be treated.

I absolutely LOVE to make people laugh, even if I have to poke fun at myself to get the laugh.

[pomba gira]

Even with a minor learning disabilities (like dyslexia or ADHD), some people can communicate fine.

1. ADHD is not a learning disability

2. Some can't. Not in writing, anyway. Others could with a lot of intensive teaching, but have never had the opportunity to receive it. Remember until very recently learning disabilities were not recognized- students with LD were just written off as cognitively impaired or condemned for "not trying" or "not applying themself".

3. Not all LDs are "minor".

In fact, a lot of people with certain disabilities communicate better than these lazy chat room/message board people simply because they make a genuine effort. In the days of spell check (I love you Firefox), there is no excuse for dozens of typos per post, yet you see obvious and unexcused misspellings in nearly every thread of this forum.

I understand these concepts in great depth. Usual judgments get thrown out for justified cases. However, people simply too lazy to write coherently when they are fully capable are not taken into consideration.

But how do you know if it's a "justified case"? In most cases you have no idea what that person's situation is, so maybe it would be more fair to withhold the condemnation across the board.

And... you are right, your personal opinion shouldn't really matter to anyone else. But unfortunately the attitude you hold is quite widespread, and leads to a lot of discrimination and unfair judgments in day to day life for a whole lot of people. One of the biggest challenges I face as a special ed teacher is working around the stigma of low intelligence that is so often unfairly attached to all special needs students. So when I see this pernicious and damaging attitude being expressed, I'm bound to comment on it. Every consciousness I raise may be one less barrier down the road for one of my kids.