Ancient Rome Vs Usa

[Msterbeau]

Our workstations suck..... i emptied the cache and deleted cookies, and i still dont see any doggie. :(

Hit the "reload" button?

Worked for me.

[jadnifer]

I see the puppy and he is adorable!

[odims_sphere]

Ahh yes, they DID have dogs in ancient Rome AND in the USA!

Keep it on topic people, or start a new thread

[boshy]

And yet they created art, technology, healthcare, public education, systems of government, legal systems, literature, etc... And actually were one of the most tollerant political institutions of the times (by ancient standards) Could hardly call them nothing but a bunch of thugs, gangsters and murderers...kind of a gross generalization IMO. I can't characterize an entire civilization that lasted hundreds and hundreds of years in such simple terms.

poop! created nothing! stole it from the greeks you mean. the only thing that they had going for them was that they were great engineers. they invented concrete and a massive highway system that is still used in places today (hence the saying "alll roads lead to rome--literally they did). their economy was based on slave labor and conquering and subjugating other countries to extract tax money (the subjects didn't really notice at first their lives were so rustic that one dictator or an other was all the same to them, and they were allowed to keep their own religions which was important). the "free education" was for "citizens" which were like mafia families (in my opinion). most of the population of rome were conquered slaves who were literally property and who had no rights. life expectancy on average was probably less than it was in acient greece which was 22 years (which was actually better than early insustrial england 200 years ago it was 17 but that's another thread). they were not artistic they were, not original, even their gods were take from greece. zeus= jupiter, posidon=neptune, etc. they did not invent democracy the greeks did. they did come up with a senate but it was not a democratic one. what they did really well, was copy. what others came up with they copied it well - i'll give them that one. ha you got me going on history which is only a hobby of mine. i was going to have my old ass take a nap but i typed this instead. now i have to skip my nap because i gotta a lot of work to do. --> no don't want to do work---> but i have to do work--->don't want to do work-- >but......arrgh

[Steven]

Ahh yes, they DID have dogs in ancient Rome AND in the USA!

Keep it on topic people, or start a new thread

he's a Roman Shepard breed....totally on topic.

Boshy did you jsut say POOP!!???

[Troy Spiral (13)]

Ancient Rome's history covers something like 10% of all recorded history , cannot be summarized in any simplistic explanation. Nazism as a governmental institution is hard to summarize , but far easier since it was a virtual hiccup in historical time. Overall the thrust of roman history is so different from National Socialism as to make the comparison virtually useless. Its a lack of understanding of history that often causes these facile comparisons between "violent meanness" of society A with society B which have very little in common.

Nazism was a throwback to earlier times, by a single cult-leader and his followers that only is notable for the scale of its destruction due to its use of modern technology to do so, the same ideas and ideals of jackasses all throughout history have been there, they just didn't have the technology to do it. The vast thrust of ancient roman history was progressive. Although seen from the narrow-viewpoint of our modern culture the violence can be blinding to the actual historical perspective.

The ancient historical Nation of Israel and its genocidal purges are a far more close comparison to Nazism's genocidal purges. As ironic and sick as that comparison sounds, its a much better comparison.

[boshy]

No but the Romans (and I didint say they did invent it) had a way of making an impression by leaving the crucified victim up for public consumption for the eyes to see......to me its sort of like chopping the hand off of a theif in the middle east.....the Crucifix was an undeniable symbolf of Roman ABSOLUTE authority that was intended to produce fear and dread.

Roman rule was blatantly founded in dread. Even you rpeace sign - that's nero's Cross is it not? Its an inverted cross with broken arms symbolising the breaking of Christianity - its not a peace sign - its a sign of fear.

What else was Rome famous for?

Gluttony of power.

Celebrated Gluttony in general - eat, fuck, puke. Do it again. Hand me that leg of lamb, and your kingdom, and your daughter, and your wife, and your farm, and then pay homage with your taxes.

speaking of fucking - the Romans had little child sex slaves, boys most of the time.

VD up the ass. little boys being fucked, up the ass.

Lead Pipe poisoning and madness.

internal overthrows and bloodletting among family members for power

Yes we had the atom bomb. But were nto talking about America - were talking about Rome.

do you think any of what I just described would prove to be offensive in the eyes of a devout jew?

actually the comparisons between the u.s. and rome are interesting. the fall of the roman empire was dut to the fact that they average citizen was givin a constant stream of free bread and free entertainment, through the extravagent and bloody shows at the coliseum. the life style was unsuatinable kinda like how we award government entitlements to our citizens (i work at a school where parents make a living enrolling their kids to get welfare or social secuity because they had a kid. too bad my kid's father wan't in jail while she was growing up. i'd have made a nice $400-500 in social security, yes the social security that will not be there for you when you retire, a month. instead i worked for a living. = opps another thread) like the u.s. they were greedy, they way over extended themselves. they had no real economy but going to war and taking goods from other people. kinda like how people here have maxed out their credit cards and then pulled the money out of their houses to buy stuff they can't really afford, like big screen tv's, from china. then when they have to pay the piper. the slightest drop in home prices prevents them from sellin their maxed out homes (because they can't get what they owe on them) then they loose said homes. and the more repo'ed home that go on the market the more the prices drop. then they had the invasions of the huns to deal with. humm... we have al qaeda to deal with interesting.

[boshy]

Ancient Rome's history covers something like 10% of all recorded history , cannot be summarized in any simplistic explanation. Nazism as a governmental institution is hard to summarize , but far easier since it was a virtual hiccup in historical time. Overall the thrust of roman history is so different from National Socialism as to make the comparison virtually useless. Its a lack of understanding of history that often causes these facile comparisons between "violent meanness" of society A with society B which have very little in common.

Nazism was a throwback to earlier times, by a single cult-leader and his followers that only is notable for the scale of its destruction due to its use of modern technology to do so, the same ideas and ideals of jackasses all throughout history have been there, they just didn't have the technology to do it. The vast thrust of ancient roman history was progressive. Although seen from the narrow-viewpoint of our modern culture the violence can be blinding to the actual historical perspective.

The ancient historical Nation of Israel and its genocidal purges are a far more close comparison to Nazism's genocidal purges. As ironic and sick as that comparison sounds, its a much better comparison.

see i told you i was prolly ignorant. history is a hobby. my college majors were science, mathematics, and music. still as an old lady. i think people are people are people. and i politely disagree with you. hum i need a cold one. bye

[creatureofthenyte]

Very interesting indeed Boshy. What goes around comes around...interesting. I think it was Crank, in another thread that compared the USA to the Roman empire, and he said something about the Roman empire falling and how the US will too if we keep going the way we have been. Almost gives me the creeps thinkin aboot it.

[boshy]

Very interesting indeed Boshy. What goes around comes around...interesting. I think it was Crank, in another thread that compared the USA to the Roman empire, and he said something about the Roman empire falling and how the US will too if we keep going the way we have been. Almost gives me the creeps thinkin aboot it.

naw! we won't fail. we are too educated (unlike the basic roman). we'll just have another recession like in the 70's. we had to wait in line for gas, couldn't buy toilet paper even if you had the money. lowest interest rate on a home mortgage (or anything) was 13% (thank you jimmy carter). you could only get a job at mcdonalds if you knew the owner. radical terrorists made a regular practice of shooting inocent business men through the brain after their planes had landed in airports and throwing their bodies out on to the tarmac just to emphasize their message (what ever it was). we survived. i remember. iwas there. don't your parents ever say the "back in the day" stuff to you? everyone will survive now too. it's just that most people now are so spoiled that if they can't have their latte' from starbucks every day and electronic toys to play with then, *the world must be ending*. people are pretty resilient and after a while they'll figure it out and know what to do. no, the world is not coming to an end. also global warming will be good for michigan (unless we let them take our water and pipe it to place where humans shouldn't be living in the first place) but bad for other places. homosapians = wise man we'll work it out. also, i believe most people are basically good.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

You sure it's The reason Rome fell? Do you know how many major theory's there are on why Rome fell? VD, lead Poisoning from the lead dinner plates and flat ware, a couple different theory's of how it was the military fault, In breading in the nobles and more. It just reached an apex and collapsed. No one can definitively say why.

[Steven]

naw! we won't fail. we are too educated (unlike the basic roman). we'll just have another recession like in the 70's. we had to wait in line for gas, couldn't buy toilet paper even if you had the money. lowest interest rate on a home mortgage (or anything) was 13% (thank you jimmy carter). you could only get a job at mcdonalds if you knew the owner. radical terrorists made a regular practice of shooting inocent business men through the brain after their planes had landed in airports and throwing their bodies out on to the tarmac just to emphasize their message (what ever it was). we survived. i remember. iwas there. don't your parents ever say the "back in the day" stuff to you? everyone will survive now too. it's just that most people now are so spoiled that if they can't have their latte' from starbucks every day and electronic toys to play with then, *the world must be ending*. people are pretty resilient and after a while they'll figure it out and know what to do. no, the world is not coming to an end. also global warming will be good for michigan (unless we let them take our water and pipe it to place where humans shouldn't be living in the first place) but bad for other places. homosapians = wise man we'll work it out. also, i believe most people are basically good.

I was there too.

I saw the first seeds of many families that began to accept on a wider scale - divorces and an ever increasing generation gap fueld by basic distrust of one another's value systems. Saw the polyester leisure suit (i was a little kid and I had one - it was purple but I couldnt grow sideburns yet) alcohol fueld get togethors pave the way for Cocaine parties in the 80's......

I remember getting by on mY fathers Mexican gardening route with me and my brothers as his labor force....I remember following the headlines your describing, watching my parents sweat the bills, watchign everybody sweat teh bills but then again everybody had a mom at home and one income and now we sweat the bills more than ever with dual incomes....I remember the influx of Laotion refugees into our San Fransisco schools and subsequent division of nationalities on the blacktop in our public school system that seperated blacks from whites from mexicans from "others" and the subsequent violence that followed, I remember watchgin my first (of many) incredibly violent and bloody gang ewar in the halls fo teh school and out in front over a racial slur, i remember getting my ass beat for sticking up for a kid named Ali from Iran when the shaw was overthrown and his father had enough scratch to get them to the states and he came to America as a kid to be taunted, abused, and harassed but seldom protected by staff at school because he was one of them fucking Iranians, and I also remember the general feeling and the fortitude of people then versus now....and I think they are radically different types of people and that technology alone makes for radically different times and values.

In general I think the ratio of americans who lack basic coping skills in relation to the common day challanges we now face is a completely different sort of animal than it was in the 70's. And that being "good" has literally nothing to do with what were capapble of in the end. I think we've been generationally bred down to bend the knee, and that we will and that even though we may indeed be educated and fortunate we hardly have the heart of a lion anymore and in the end THAT will be our eventual undoing.

[Steven]

You sure it's The reason Rome fell? Do you know how many major theory's there are on why Rome fell? VD, lead Poisoning from the lead dinner plates and flat ware, a couple different theory's of how it was the military fault, In breading in the nobles and more. It just reached an apex and collapsed. No one can definitively say why.

I think the word "gluttony" eloquently sums up all that you just sugggested Mark.

and I would tend to agree with you.

I also think that every utopia crumbles for the same reason.