McCain picks Alaska gov as running mate.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Hey Gaf

"The number of nesting pairs of Bald Eagles in the lower 48 states had increased from less than 500 in the early 1960's to over 10,000 in 2007. "

Their delisted...but still under close observation...even there are over 10,000 nesting PAIRS....so thats like 20,000 birds just in North America.

I see no reason for not keeping an eye on the bears....maybe not the endangered list...but their current "vulnerable" status is a good one.

oh...and one question....are those facts on the bears counting EVERYTHING....or just that in the wild??

Wiki:

"Of the 19 recognized polar bear subpopulations, 5 are declining, 5 are stable, 2 are increasing, and 7 have insufficient data"

Declining and stable don't seem like enough to warrant to say the bears are "o-tay".

"The IUCN now lists global warming as the most significant threat to the polar bear, primarily because the melting of its sea ice habitat reduces its ability to find sufficient food. Sea ice melting will also cause changes in their mating, and traveling patterns. The IUCN states, "If climatic trends continue polar bears may become extirpated from most of their range within 100 years."

Hey...is Global Warming that effect that Palin insist's isn't the fault of human beings??

and yet...

CSA.com

"As CRS Issue Brief RL30792, The Endangered Species Act: Consideration of Economic Factors (January 2001; April 2003) explains, "the listing stage may include facts related to a species population, habitat, distribution, etc., as well as threats to its continued survival, but must not include economic factors."

OMG....does that mean the Global Warming is effecting the habitat and distribution of the polar bears??

What is your point? All I said was please go get educated on the issue because there is so much disinformation put out by activist groups that most people think that Polar Bears are on the verge of extinction... and they are not.

[Oh_My_Goth]

Sooooo, let Me get this straight.....

There are people who are actually going to vote for these Fuck-tards?????

Really, really?????

*packs bags*

[Goth Brooks]

so it's ok to debate something, but not have the information on half the debate??....COMON!!!!

Are you seriously advocating the teaching of creationism in public schools?

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Professor J. Scott Armstrong of the Wharton School says, “To list a species that is currently in good health as an endangered species requires valid forecasts that its population would decline to levels that threaten its viability. In fact, the polar bear populations have been increasing rapidly in recent decades due to hunting restrictions. Assuming these restrictions remain, the most appropriate forecast is to assume that the upward trend would continue for a few years, then level off.

“These studies are meant to inform the US Fish and Wildlife Service about listing the polar bear as endangered. After careful examination, my co-authors and I were unable to find any references to works providing evidence that the forecasting methods used in the reports had been previously validated. In essence, they give no scientific basis for deciding one way or the other about the polar bear.”

Prof. Armstrong and colleagues originally undertook their audit at the request of the State of Alaska. The subsequent study, “Polar Bear Population Forecasts: A Public Policy Forecasting Audit,” is by Prof. Armstrong, Kesten G. Green of Monash University in Australia, and Willie Soon of the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics. It is scheduled to appear in the September/October issue of the INFORMS journal Interfaces.

Professor Armstrong is author of Long-Range Forecasting, the most frequently cited book on forecasting methods, and Principles of Forecasting. He is a co-founder of the Journal of Forecasting, the International Journal of Forecasting, the International Symposium on Forecasting, and forecastingprinciples.com.

The authors examined nine U.S. Geological Survey Administrative Reports. The studies include “Forecasting the Wide-Range Status of Polar Bears at Selected Times in the 21st Century” by Steven C. Amstrup et. al. and “Polar Bears in the Southern Beaufort Sea II: Demography and Population Growth in Relation to Sea Ice Conditions” by Christine M. Hunter et al.

Prof. Armstrong and his colleagues concluded that the most relevant study, Amstrup et al. properly applied only 15% of relevant forecasting principles and that the second study, Hunter et al. only 10%, while 46% were clearly contravened and 23% were apparently contravened.

Further, they write, the Geologic Survey reports do not adequately substantiate the authors’ assumptions about changes to sea ice and polar bears’ ability to adapt that are key to the recommendations.

Institute for Operations Research and the Management Sciences (2008, May 10). Federal Polar Bear Research Critically Flawed, Forecasting Expert Asserts. ScienceDaily. Retrieved August 30, 2008, from http://www.sciencedaily.com­ /releases/2008/05/080508132549.htm

[Goth Brooks]

Her daughters are nomnomnom

[the eternal]

So, how come no one put up any sexy photoshop pictures of Biden?

Hmmm?

I'm waiting...

I don't need photoshop when I have fine-ass pics of my man Biden right here.

Oh, and Goth Brooks: please stay away from schools, churchs, and neighborhood playgrounds.

Thank you

[phee]

Sooooo, let Me get this straight.....

There are people who are actually going to vote for these Fuck-tards?????

Really, really?????

*packs bags*

NOT IT

[Rev.Reverence]

I don't need photoshop when I have fine-ass pics of my man Biden right here.

Oh, and Goth Brooks: please stay away from schools, churchs, and neighborhood playgrounds.

Thank you

He's not bad lookin'...

Kinda' looks like a smart fella'...

[Goth Brooks]

Oh, and Goth Brooks: please stay away from schools, churchs, and neighborhood playgrounds.

Thank you

DIAF

[phee]

Lets keep it civil please

[Simon Bar Sinister]

Michael Palin would've been a more qualified pick.

[the eternal]

Hey, Phee, DIAF needs to be said and referenced more often!

There's nothing wrong if my brah Goth Brooks wants to share the love about the Dangdai International Art Festival. There's some beautiful and provocative art there.

With the new world focus on China, with the Olympics and all, I'm for one impressed that GB turned us on

to an oft-overlooked art festival---DIAF

[Guest GodfallenPromos]

What is your point? All I said was please go get educated on the issue because there is so much disinformation put out by activist groups that most people think that Polar Bears are on the verge of extinction... and they are not.

I never said that they were on the verge of extinction....what I was pointing out that Palin doesn't seem to care much about the fact that their habitat IS in danger from Global Warming.

We can't ignore that Global Warming IS happening...and that the high exposure of CFC gases in the past years has only accelerated it. CFC gases, to my re-collection, are NOT naturally occuring...and therefore man-made. If that is the case, then Palin is coming off rather incompetent, wouldn't you agree?

She is coming off as the Dan Quail of the female Republican's, IMO.

[Guest GodfallenPromos]

Are you seriously advocating the teaching of creationism in public schools?

you didn't pay attention, did you?

Palin is advocating the right to DEBATE Creationism vs. Evolution in schools, but is actively against TEACHING Creationism in schools.

Thats like telling you it's ok to debate Democracy vs. Socialism, and not teaching them anything about Socialism.

If your going to advocate the right to debate over it, you should advocate the right to be allowed to teach it.

[freydis]

you didn't pay attention, did you?

Palin is advocating the right to DEBATE Creationism vs. Evolution in schools, but is actively against TEACHING Creationism in schools.

Thats like telling you it's ok to debate Democracy vs. Socialism, and not teaching them anything about Socialism.

If your going to advocate the right to debate over it, you should advocate the right to be allowed to teach it.

Thats not really a good arguement.

One is science, the other religion. Debating it in science class..... whatever. It's acknowledging that some would rather take a religious stance on the orgins of earth. But its a science class. You wouldnt be teaching biology in a sociology class, why teach religion in a science class?

[n0Mad]

When I say these two, just for clarification, I mean Obama and McCain.

Oh, good. 'Cuz I thought you were staring at Palin's tits.

so it's ok to debate something, but not have the information on half the debate??....COMON!!!!

I didn't say I was debating. I said I was arguing simply for the sake of argument. You don't need facts for arguments.

Do too.

Do not.

Do too.

Do not.

I'm for change.

I espouse reform.

Same thing.

Is not.

Your mother.

I'm a hockey mom.

Wanna go make out?

We can't ignore that Global Warming IS happening...and that the high exposure of CFC gases in the past years has only accelerated it. CFC gases, to my re-collection, are NOT naturally occuring...and therefore man-made.

I could be wrong, but I thought CFCs were those things we were having problems with in the 80s. You know, from aerosols and styrofoam. If so, CFC deplete the ozone layer which lead to global cooling. Remember the whole, "The Next Ice Age!" scare in the 80s? A strong ozone layer and greenhouse gasses are what keeps the heat held in and contributes to global warming. So more CFCs would help reduce global warming, not contribute to it. But, I haven't studied any of this so could just be talking out my ass.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

No, your right. Global warming actually "thickens" the Ozone layer. Ozone breaks down way faster in a cold enviroment.

Also, CFCs are all organic. Not natural, but all organic.

None of that really matters though. CFCs are almost none-existant now.

I think he was thinking of Carbon Dioxide, Methane and Ethane. Those are the gases most blamed for Global warming. They are not only organic, they are natural. By products of Life.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

GFP - This is where you try to tell us that Carbon Dioxide isn't natural and that we all need to stop creating it.

[freydis]

GFP - This is where you try to tell us that Carbon Dioxide isn't natural and that we all need to stop creating it.

Dammit, quit breathing!

[Head Wreck]

the question is.

are you getting a person able to do the job. or a person who cant do the job but gets votes.

i'd rather the usefull than usless.

i would have thought tony blair's 10 years of utter and complete fail would have taught them that its better to get people in that can do the job rather than people who utterly screw up and got the job because the idiot masses prefered thier reproductive organs.

[SaGa]

co2 is needed. without a good source of co2 plants whould not make any sugar to survive on. i agree with gaf that ch2(methane) is much more a greenhouse gas then co2. but hey debating about it, if you believe or not, so what, most people are skeptical and will only follow green measures as a way of life. mostly if it means they save a buck or fight the possible energy cost spikes. most are not thinking of co2 as much as there thinking of more economic ways to live..

those who believe in global warming. are going to be happy anyways, as the economy is searching for a alt to oil and coal out of fears of dwindling supplies. and of course there going to use that to sway the course as it is progress in there eyes.....

buisnessess are killing 2 birds with one stone in marketing products. going green and making better use of energy in there products so the consumer can save a few bucks in the long run. and feel better that there "doing the right thing" how is that not a future win win for any buisness

[Guest Megalicious]

Dammit, quit breathing!

[Guest GodfallenPromos]

No, your right. Global warming actually "thickens" the Ozone layer. Ozone breaks down way faster in a cold enviroment.

Also, CFCs are all organic. Not natural, but all organic.

None of that really matters though. CFCs are almost none-existant now.

I think he was thinking of Carbon Dioxide, Methane and Ethane. Those are the gases most blamed for Global warming. They are not only organic, they are natural. By products of Life.

none existant in most Top world countries. Many places like New Zealand and Rwanda still have homes with the CFC emmiting refrigerators.

I also said "from my recollection"...which is as follows

"CFCs have been found to pose a serious environmental threat. Studies undertaken by various scientists during the 1970s revealed that CFCs released into the atmosphere accumulate in the stratosphere, where they had a deleterious effect on the ozone layer. Stratospheric ozone shields living organisms on Earth from the harmful effects of the Sun's ultraviolet radiation; even a relatively small decrease in the stratospheric ozone concentration can result in an increased incidence of skin cancer in humans and in genetic damage in many organisms. In the stratosphere the CFC molecules break down by the action of solar ultraviolet radiation and release their constituent chlorine atoms. These then react with the ozone molecules, resulting in their removal.

CFCs have a lifetime in the atmosphere of about 20 to 100 years, and consequently one free chlorine atom from a CFC molecule can do a lot of damage, destroying ozone molecules for a long time. Although emissions of CFCs around the developed world have largely ceased due to international control agreements, the damage to the stratospheric ozone layer will continue well into the 21st century."

so Gaf....I'm not sure hwo your saying that CFC's aren't a major part of the problem

btw...my information is from the following:

The Ozone Hole

It's a site that actually has many similar articles archived...towards the bottom.

[sass_in_the_pants]

You want em, YOU put em up. But if you think Biden is sexy, you have bigger problems to worry about. Like your eyesight.

I would but I don't do that photoshop thingy! YOU people do that! I don't know how! I did type 'sexy Joe Biden' into my yahoo web browser and very scary things came up.

Be careful what you wish for I guess...

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

none existant in most Top world countries. Many places like New Zealand and Rwanda still have homes with the CFC emmiting refrigerators.

I also said "from my recollection"...which is as follows

"CFCs have been found to pose a serious environmental threat. Studies undertaken by various scientists during the 1970s revealed that CFCs released into the atmosphere accumulate in the stratosphere, where they had a deleterious effect on the ozone layer. Stratospheric ozone shields living organisms on Earth from the harmful effects of the Sun's ultraviolet radiation; even a relatively small decrease in the stratospheric ozone concentration can result in an increased incidence of skin cancer in humans and in genetic damage in many organisms. In the stratosphere the CFC molecules break down by the action of solar ultraviolet radiation and release their constituent chlorine atoms. These then react with the ozone molecules, resulting in their removal.

CFCs have a lifetime in the atmosphere of about 20 to 100 years, and consequently one free chlorine atom from a CFC molecule can do a lot of damage, destroying ozone molecules for a long time. Although emissions of CFCs around the developed world have largely ceased due to international control agreements, the damage to the stratospheric ozone layer will continue well into the 21st century."

so Gaf....I'm not sure hwo your saying that CFC's aren't a major part of the problem

btw...my information is from the following:

The Ozone Hole

It's a site that actually has many similar articles archived...towards the bottom.

I thought I stated my point pretty clearly.

You linked CFCs to Global Warming. I pointed out that CFCs actually cause Global Cooling and that Global Warming actually works against the affects of CFCs.

Spook also pointed this out.

Perhaps you should read the link you posted.