What is "goth" ?

[Rev.Reverence]

Oh, but one thing I find wrong with that...the punk scene is not really that boring...but then again it could be where you live...

...OR how old you are...

*tussles Candy's hair*

[candyman]

...OR how old you are...

*tussles Candy's hair*

I happen to know quite a few old punks thank you very much!

And you should really wash your hands...I haven't washed my hair since my surgery on friday...its nasty!

[Rev.Reverence]

I happen to know quite a few old punks thank you very much!

And you should really wash your hands...I haven't washed my hair since my surgery on friday...its nasty!

..but the point stands..go ask them the older the age..the less punks...I still LIKE some punk tunes (ie. the Dead Kennedys)...but I am not really into the punk scene...I find it the same with a WHOLE lot of my peoples...

...that's oK...I have not washed mine in twice as long at least.

[candyman]

..but the point stands..go ask them the older the age..the less punks...I still LIKE some punk tunes (ie. the Dead Kennedys)...but I am not really into the punk scene...I find it the same with a WHOLE lot of my peoples...

...that's oK...I have not washed mine in twice as long at least.

That is true...punk is still alive and kicking but I guess since its doing what its supposed to not many people know about...I belive that age should not matter at all no matter what scene it is...damn sellouts! Oh well, I guess I will be the only old person wearing Docs and tight pants when I get to that age where you supposed to ''grow up"...

and I should also say that I also have some nasty anti-something goop left in my hair too...I smell like a hospital

[Rev.Reverence]

That is true...punk is still alive and kicking but I guess since its doing what its supposed to not many people know about...I belive that age should not matter at all no matter what scene it is...damn sellouts! Oh well, I guess I will be the only old person wearing Docs and tight pants when I get to that age where you supposed to ''grow up"...

and I should also say that I also have some nasty anti-something goop left in my hair too...I smell like a hospital

HA! I never sold out my friend...I am a friek through & through...my tastes changed...I prefer a bit more refinement...like actual singing with notes..& melodies...

[candyman]

HA! I never sold out my friend...I am a friek through & through...my tastes changed...I prefer a bit more refinement...like actual singing with notes..& melodies...

I never called YOU a sellout...rather those that are "part" of a scene while it is popular/"alive" and then they try to forget it when it is not popular/"dead"...

refinement is for losers ...how else have the big three american motor companies keep selling shit? Because nobody likes refinement thats why!

[Rev.Reverence]

I never called YOU a sellout...rather those that are "part" of a scene while it is popular/"alive" and then they try to forget it when it is not popular/"dead"...

refinement is for losers ...how else have the big three american motor companies keep selling shit? Because nobody likes refinement thats why!

...I am nobody...

*gloomy~goth~pose*

[DJDeadbeat]

Goth was a reaction because goths found the punk scene's three chords, drinking, OI OI OI, brash, masculinity boring and played out. I personally believe it still is. I can't name one punk band besides the Stiffs Inc in the 90's who brought something INTERESTING to the table. Just me.

Mind you this was 1982, so not much has changed. But gothic punk still was punk. And I'm not slagging punk, my life would be empty without anarcho/peace-punk, the Adicts and such.

But goth was a reaction to the mundane punk they loved, but just wanted to play around more with. Have more fun!

[DJDeadbeat]

After you hear stuff like Public Image Limited, Wire, Josef K, Fad Gadget, Crass, Sex Gang Children....punk just seems like childsplay!

[Rev.Reverence]

After you hear stuff like Public Image Limited, Wire, Josef K, Fad Gadget, Crass, Sex Gang Children....punk just seems like childsplay!

All great bands...but Joseph K stands out as one of my newly discovered favorites.

[DJDeadbeat]

All great bands...but Joseph K stands out as one of my newly discovered favorites.

Great song, if you like them, check our Orange Juice and the Fire Engines!

[Guest greyhalo]

Gloria Mundi, UK Decay, Adam and the Antz, Bauhaus, Rocky Horror Picture Show, A sense of humour, boredom of the punk scene, romanticization of love, death, religion, and taboo naive subject matter, a fascination and appreciation for the beauty in everything.

Boom, suck it. I did it in a run-on sentence. Didn't even mention the word black in there.

I often mention early post-punk bands like these as well. I know that Abbo from UK Decay actually referred to their music as being "gothic" back in the day. But, a lot of people still like to lump them in with the punk movement in the late 70s and early 80s. Although, like you said, a lot of post-punk bands wanted to get away from the punk scene and do something that had more artistic merit.

[Joey Deadcat]

Justyn's back! So when we gonna see you @ Deadline?

[DJDeadbeat]

Dude, I wish. I've been so tight on money and job hunting that I haven't had much time for clubbin' sadly. Maybe soon. The playlists look excellent.

[DJDeadbeat]

I often mention early post-punk bands like these as well. I know that Abbo from UK Decay actually referred to their music as being "gothic" back in the day. But, a lot of people still like to lump them in with the punk movement in the late 70s and early 80s. Although, like you said, a lot of post-punk bands wanted to get away from the punk scene and do something that had more artistic merit.

Rightfully so, goth is a form of punk.

[Joey Deadcat]

Rightfully so, goth is a form of punk.

Well, you gotta remember, too, that the bands from that era were dubbed "positive-punk".

Hope to see you do a guest spot at Deadline, btw!

[TheOsakaKoneko]

Well, you gotta remember, too, that the bands from that era were dubbed "positive-punk".

Hope to see you do a guest spot at Deadline, btw!

I tried to ask my parents what the image was of goth back in the day. They couldn't tell me. I said, well, had you ever heard of positive punk? Or post punk? They said, "That's POSITIVE???"

Then again, they thought goth was ACDC and Ozzy and Black Sabbath.

I guess that's the equivalent of people thinking it's Manson today.

So much for the theory that goth was mainstream when it first got started and that 'normal' people would know anything about it.

[Joey Deadcat]

I tried to ask my parents what the image was of goth back in the day. They couldn't tell me. I said, well, had you ever heard of positive punk? Or post punk? They said, "That's POSITIVE???"

Then again, they thought goth was ACDC and Ozzy and Black Sabbath.

I guess that's the equivalent of people thinking it's Manson today.

So much for the theory that goth was mainstream when it first got started and that 'normal' people would know anything about it.

The name never quite stuck but back then (early 80s)British music journalists were using it to describe bands like Theatre Of Hate, Sex Gang Children, UK Decay, etc.

[DJDeadbeat]

The name never quite stuck but back then (early 80s)British music journalists were using it to describe bands like Theatre Of Hate, Sex Gang Children, UK Decay, etc.

It was silly. Even Jello Biafra said "the British music press had the gull to call it Positive Punk"! Listen to "Afterwards" by Artery and tell me thats positive! But I guess compared to The Exploited and singing about hating your parents and drinking beer, singing about life, death, religion, and impersonal feelings is kind of nice.

[DJDeadbeat]

Well, you gotta remember, too, that the bands from that era were dubbed "positive-punk".

Hope to see you do a guest spot at Deadline, btw!

I'd LOVE to, if theres ever a chance. I know Scary Guy and Stevie (David Blunk). Stevies a real gent for playing coldwave and minimal in the mix!

[Scary Guy]

I'd LOVE to, if theres ever a chance. I know Scary Guy and Stevie (David Blunk). Stevies a real gent for playing coldwave and minimal in the mix!

I'm sure we can work something out especially now that we're doing two rooms again. Come out and talk to Wilhelm about it. Half of us there will be able to vouch for you.

[DJDeadbeat]

I'm sure we can work something out especially now that we're doing two rooms again. Come out and talk to Wilhelm about it. Half of us there will be able to vouch for you.

Thanks man. I do appreciate it. I'll hopefully be out this Wednesday to see all of the hulabaloo.

[Stymie]

Goth is such a loose term. Then again so is Punk. Or it was. People do not know shit. So they just toss something that, to what they can relate to a little. Little Goth... Your either are or not. Like me I am more a Industrial Child then anything else. So are a lot of ppl here. Well I think. But it is just how my life evolved.

Some labels are just plan dumb. Like Indie>.> For music. Lets put hardcore, pop, new age, and so on into one type>.> WTF

ok I'm doing one

On Labels: "LABELS" are necessary for civilization to exist. We can't even communicate on a level other than grunts and throwing shit at each other without them. Don't like labels? Sorry. Unless your moving back into the caves, they are here to stay.

They are not necessary for civilization to exist. It is creativity that is necessary. And monkeys grunts and throwing shit at each other. They do have a language. Those things are part of it. It would be same for a "caveman/woman." Labels did not make fire, arrows, knife from stone and so on. Creativity did.

[Rev.Reverence]

Goth is such a loose term. Then again so is Punk. Or it was. People do not know shit. So they just toss something that, to what they can relate to a little. Little Goth... Your either are or not. Like me I am more a Industrial Child then anything else. So are a lot of ppl here. Well I think. But it is just how my life evolved.

Some labels are just plan dumb. Like Indie>.> For music. Lets put hardcore, pop, new age, and so on into one type>.> WTF

ok I'm doing one

They are not necessary for civilization to exist. It is creativity that is necessary. And monkeys grunts and throwing shit at each other. They do have a language. Those things are part of it. It would be same for a "caveman/woman." Labels did not make fire, arrows, knife from stone and so on. Creativity did.

Labeling fire as "hot" makes it clear that this will burn you...every single word is a label..at least every noun & adjective...& I think adverbs......verbs are not labels..nor I think the predicates & conjunctions...I could be wrong...

[Stymie]

It doesn't. But, It is still creativity that is necessary. Not labels. I can have someone do a lot of things. Just by pointing. It is creative that made it. Even giving the power to label something. Because someone had to be creative. To name something. From be it: words or classes of whatever. No matter how simple the idea was.