TEA Party

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

The next big TEA party is being planned for the 4th of July.

We had, depending on who you listen to, between 300,000-500,00 at the Tax Day Tea Partys at just over 700 locations. We are hoping for even more at the Independence Day Tea Party.

I will post all the info I can as soon as I get it.

[ttogreh]

Ok, 500,000 people, 700 locations. That comes out to about 715 people per location. Obviously, some places had 30 people, and some had 3,000.

On February 15, 2003, somewhere between 10 and 15 million people in sixty countries protested the upcoming Iraq invasion. Forgive me if I am less than impressed.

[Slogo]

Ok, 500,000 people, 700 locations. That comes out to about 715 people per location. Obviously, some places had 30 people, and some had 3,000.

On February 15, 2003, somewhere between 10 and 15 million people in sixty countries protested the upcoming Iraq invasion. Forgive me if I am less than impressed.

But that doesn't count because they were liberals and liberals hate America and prefer an Islamic theocracy because nothing says liberalism like women putting on more clothes

[candyman]

Ok, 500,000 people, 700 locations. That comes out to about 715 people per location. Obviously, some places had 30 people, and some had 3,000.

On February 15, 2003, somewhere between 10 and 15 million people in sixty countries protested the upcoming Iraq invasion. Forgive me if I am less than impressed.

That was also 60 countries...who don't like the US...they like our foreign aid but that is about it.

Not to start a thing about war but...who like it anyways? I don't think anyone in the history of the universe LIKED any war. No crap, people are going to protest it. Thankfully, we are to the point here where nobody is killed or injured while protesting, even if they are of a different religion. You may get put on a list but at least you don't end up at a body dump without your head if you don't like something or give aid to the "invaders".

Also, many cities that before welcomed protests turned around and put huge restrictions on these tea parties...funny because the was one of the very few protests where the Madison police didn't have to break out tear gas and clubs for a "peaceful" protest...

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

What ever.

You can try to denounce, belittle, demoralize and discredit this movement all you want.

None of that will change the fact this is a fast growing grass roots movement with a strong message to give to the people in Washington.

Edited April 20, 2009 by Gaf The Horse With Tears

[ttogreh]

I will believe it when I see it. Right now, all I am seeing is Fox News Channel endorsed astroturf events. Now, if this actually does become some sort of coherent anti-waste. anti-big government movement, I certainly won't have any room to dismiss it as a bunch of malcontents being manipulated by those that would like to dismantle the welfare state.

Right now, I am seeing a bunch of people who have lower income taxes protesting against tax increases.

[Scary Guy]

It's a great idea, but the name is still retarded.

There is no throwing tea into a river = not a tea party.

Let me know if you see Epic Fail Guy there though.

[candyman]

It's a great idea, but the name is still retarded.

There is no throwing tea into a river = not a tea party.

Let me know if you see Epic Fail Guy there though.

My tea is too expensive to throw away for any cause...I will not buy crappy tea either...higher beings might see me do it an will punish me.

[torn asunder]

It's a great idea, but the name is still retarded.

There is no throwing tea into a river = not a tea party.

Let me know if you see Epic Fail Guy there though.

not stupid - metaphoric. it's a very effective way to communicate the attitude/intent of the "rally", protest, or whatever you'd like to call. most everyone knows what it implies, and they know it's not literal.

i assume you get that, yes?

[Scary Guy]

not stupid - metaphoric. it's a very effective way to communicate the attitude/intent of the "rally", protest, or whatever you'd like to call. most everyone knows what it implies, and they know it's not literal.

i assume you get that, yes?

It's still retarded.

It's not even involving the destruction of property in any way!

[torn asunder]

It's still retarded.

It's not even involving the destruction of property in any way!

dude, seriously - what does the average person associate with the boston tea party? protesting taxes. the exact reason is beyond many, either due to having forgotten their education, never having learned the "whys" of it, or just not caring to research, but theyalways associate tea party = taxes. how is it retarded to utilize a well-known event like this?

[Scary Guy]

dude, seriously - what does the average person associate with the boston tea party? protesting taxes. the exact reason is beyond many, either due to having forgotten their education, never having learned the "whys" of it, or just not caring to research, but they always associate tea party = taxes. how is it retarded to utilize a well-known event like this?

No throwing tea over the side of a ship = not a tea party.

Good marketing I admit, but as most marketing goes it's total crap.

I mean if people dressed all fancy and drank tea I'd have less of an issue with the name.

I also hate how people need catchy marketing to get them to protest. They should just want to protest because things are bad and it's their right to point it out, peacefully.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

So do some research. Much tea was poured into large bodys of water where allowed.

For example, at the Punta gorda Tea Party, tea was poured into Charlotte Harbor. I know this, because I was one of the people doing it. We had to respect enviromental laws. So only tea was poured in, no paper tages, bags or strings. If Fort Myers, they would not allow any solids to bepoured in... so about 50 gallons of tea was brewed and poured in. Things along this line happend all over the country and will again.

You really should find out what all these Tea Partys are about before condeming them. Taxes are aonly a small part of this movement.

[ttogreh]

This is yet another reason why I find this entire fiasco to be less than genuine. The organizers of these events thought that it was necessary to appeal to the lowest common denominator, the fuzzy memory of the Boston Tea Party. What do you get when you appeal to the lowest common denominator? People that may not have the greatest grasp of the facts, and have enough free time to protest in the middle of a work day.

In short, what conservative pollsters refer to as "low information voters".

So, what do we have here? We have an unashamedly conservative news network devoting precious time to a protest days and weeks in advance, letting people know where the nearest "Taxed Enough Already" party is going to be held, several conservative think tanks sponsoring such events, and a bunch of people who are going to have more money in their pocket because of this administration's actions protesting this administration.

It's astroturf, and it is a cynical manipulation of poorly informed people that are going to be better served by a roll-back of taxes on the rich and tax cuts on themselves.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

The values the country was founded on are the lowest common demoninator? and a bad thing?

I will admit that some of the larger events were sponsered by Conservative groups. Fox News did give them free add space.

Puts them right in line with Moveon.org and the Daily KOS. Or have we forgotten where they got thier seed money?

and again.. I can not stress enough.. this is about more than Taxes.

[ttogreh]

Moveon.org and the Daily KOS? Do you know what the average size of donation to Moveon.org is? Well, here is its page on Opensecrets.org That is just for the 2008 election season.

Ok, so it had receipts of $39,860,865. Individual donations exceeding $200 amounted to $4,693,253. Which means that $35,167,612 came from donors of less than $200.

Of the "large" ($200 or more) donors, the average donation size was $414.05, with less than thirty of those 1135 donors donating the maximum amount of $5,000.

Moveon.org is a grassroots organization by any reasonable definition.

The Daily KOS is a collaborative blog founded by Markos Moulitsas, a United States Army Veteran. Its members may indeed donate to Moveon.org and other political groups, but the blog itself is more like Detroitgothic.net than the Fox News Channel.

As far as your deliberate misinterpretation of my use of the words "lowest common denominator" or that this is more about taxes, the people that are out in the streets waving tea bags in the air are being led by people that want to keep their Bush Era tax cuts.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

The majority of TEA party events were paid for by the people at them. They were forced to purchase insurance and rent the public space. The TEA party in Punta Gorda for example coast $1500. A local small business man paid all the fee's and doanations were taken to pay him back.

Can you tell me who the leaders are? You seem to be one of the few that knows that there even is some central leadership.

[Scary Guy]

So do some research. Much tea was poured into large bodys of water where allowed.

For example, at the Punta gorda Tea Party, tea was poured into Charlotte Harbor. I know this, because I was one of the people doing it. We had to respect enviromental laws. So only tea was poured in, no paper tages, bags or strings. If Fort Myers, they would not allow any solids to bepoured in... so about 50 gallons of tea was brewed and poured in. Things along this line happend all over the country and will again.

You really should find out what all these Tea Partys are about before condeming them. Taxes are aonly a small part of this movement.

The original tea party wasn't about other things than taxes, it was just about the taxes on tea.

I'm also pretty sure they didn't give a shit about the environmental laws.

I'm also pretty sure they didn't own the tea they threw in the river.

FAIL

[ttogreh]

Again, I do not dispute the sincerity of the individual protestors, or do I dismiss the concerns of government waste or government oversight out of hand.

However, I do believe that several conservative groups that work together spread this TEA party meme as quickly as they could, and they knew that it would get attention because it hijacks the memory of the Boston Tea Party and couples it with the universal disdain for taxes. It really is smart marketing.

That being said, "Taxed Enough Already" parties are certainly about taxes, and when 95% of the American public has received a tax cut, it becomes obvious to me that this is about taxes on the rich, and manipulation of populist anger for elitist goals.

[creatureofthenyte]

Again, I do not dispute the sincerity of the individual protestors, or do I dismiss the concerns of government waste or government oversight out of hand.

However, I do believe that several conservative groups that work together spread this TEA party meme as quickly as they could, and they knew that it would get attention because it hijacks the memory of the Boston Tea Party and couples it with the universal disdain for taxes. It really is smart marketing.

That being said, "Taxed Enough Already" parties are certainly about taxes, and when 95% of the American public has received a tax cut, it becomes obvious to me that this is about taxes on the rich, and manipulation of populist anger for elitist goals.

Do you know what that "tax cut" amounts to ? A whole entire whopping $7.69 a week.

And the IRS isn't changing the tax law to reflect that "tax cut", so guess what ? we're gonna owe that same $7.69/week back to the IRS next year!

China isn't going to lend us money for ever ya know, so where is Obama gonna get the money to pay for all this heinously ludicrous spending ??

Yeah, that's right! He's gonna RAISE our taxes! He has no choice.

These tea party events are to protest tax increases, and to protest the growth of big government.

But alot of Democrats can't seem to grasp that concept.

They see nothing wrong with spending this country into oblivion, and sticking their kids, grandkids, and great grandkids with the tab.

[TitsMcGee]

Do you know what that "tax cut" amounts to ? A whole entire whopping $7.69 a week.

And the IRS isn't changing the tax law to reflect that "tax cut", so guess what ? we're gonna owe that same $7.69/week back to the IRS next year!

China isn't going to lend us money for ever ya know, so where is Obama gonna get the money to pay for all this heinously ludicrous spending ??

Yeah, that's right! He's gonna RAISE our taxes! He has no choice.

These tea party events are to protest tax increases, and to protest the growth of big government.

But alot of Democrats can't seem to grasp that concept.

They see nothing wrong with spending this country into oblivion, and sticking their kids, grandkids, and great grandkids with the tab.

+50 billion

[ttogreh]

Do you know what that "tax cut" amounts to ? A whole entire whopping $7.69 a week.

And the IRS isn't changing the tax law to reflect that "tax cut", so guess what ? we're gonna owe that same $7.69/week back to the IRS next year!

China isn't going to lend us money for ever ya know, so where is Obama gonna get the money to pay for all this heinously ludicrous spending ??

Yeah, that's right! He's gonna RAISE our taxes! He has no choice.

These tea party events are to protest tax increases, and to protest the growth of big government.

But alot of Democrats can't seem to grasp that concept.

They see nothing wrong with spending this country into oblivion, and sticking their kids, grandkids, and great grandkids with the tab.

All right, let's get this straight... will we owe ON the $7.69 a week, or will we owe BACK the $7.69 a week? Those are vitally different things.

As for whether or not he will have to raise income taxes is an entirely different matter altogether. Assuming that the ludicrous spending actually jump-starts economic growth in the way that people who understand it are hoping, he won't have to raise taxes, he will just have to collect taxes on the economic growth.

See, let's say in 1990, The gross national product of the economy is projected to be $100. There is the expectation of growth, but damn it all, a recession hits us. So, instead of $100, the economy is only going to make $90. The government could lower spending and let the economy work itself out, or it could start a tidy little war that will cost $10 and get things growing again.

So, this war happens, and is over in 100 hours. Now, how is it going to pay for this ten dollars? Well, the economy is growing at three per cent a year now. 1991, $103. 1992, $106.09. 1993, $109.27. 1994, $112.55...

Suddenly that ten dollars doesn't really seem like a whole hell of a lot, especially if the government stayed out of it, and 1990 was really $90, and 1991 was $90.9 and 1992 was $91.80...

Now, I am mixing the hypothetical with the allegorical here. And indeed, there is a real, concrete limit to how much we can owe other countries before they say "enough". However, I am trying to explain the thinking behind Keynesian economic theory.

[TygerLili]

Ok. I could get behind the actual concept of protest being discussed here. However...

So do some research. Much tea was poured into large bodys of water where allowed.

For example, at the Punta gorda Tea Party, tea was poured into Charlotte Harbor. I know this, because I was one of the people doing it. We had to respect enviromental laws. So only tea was poured in, no paper tages, bags or strings. If Fort Myers, they would not allow any solids to bepoured in... so about 50 gallons of tea was brewed and poured in. Things along this line happend all over the country and will again.

...this is quite a waste of time, tea and money.

Ironic way to protest what one considers to be lavish government spending.

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Ok. I could get behind the actual concept of protest being discussed here. However...

...this is quite a waste of time, tea and money.

Ironic way to protest what one considers to be lavish government spending.

The differenace between this and government spending/waste... choice.

[ttogreh]

So... you choose to protest waste with even more waste. While I think that is uniquely American, I also think it's really fucking stupid.