The oil disaster in the gulf.

[phee]

I think that everyone is handling it badly at this point.

BP... The President....

The only ones who seem to be trying to deal with it are the businesses down by the Gulf.

Obama actually only a week or two before talked about the expansion of off shore drilling.... *sigh* I think his foot is in his mouth pretty far at this point.

[IsleofRhodesEnt]

True...his foot is in his mouth...and I personally do expect some kind of sabatouge of the rig. However, I do like the fact that the goverment came down and said "Hey, BP....your paying for ALL of this...bottom line." Can't hate the responsibility being on them for the clean-up, etc.

[Rev.Reverence]

I think it's hilarious how everyone seems to be friekin' out...

..they KNEW there was a possibility of a spill...as there is ALWAYS a possibility...

..oh, did they "Believe The HYPE"?

NEVER FORGET THE MOST IMPORTANT THING THAT PUBLIC ENEMY TAUGHT US...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6BJ3CvPLhs

[Msterbeau]

Allow me to be the one to open a nice can of worms:

http://theweek.com/article/index/202791/gulf-spill-is-the-bush-administration-to-blame

"As a result, Bush's 2005 energy bill, following a Minerals Management Service recommendation, dropped a requirement that oil companies fit every deepwater oil well with a $500,000 "acoustical regulator" — an automatic shut-off switch that could have prevented the BP spill."

[phee]

Allow me to be the one to open a nice can of worms:

http://theweek.com/a...ration-to-blame

"As a result, Bush's 2005 energy bill, following a Minerals Management Service recommendation, dropped a requirement that oil companies fit every deepwater oil well with a $500,000 "acoustical regulator" — an automatic shut-off switch that could have prevented the BP spill."

[Rev.Reverence]

SON-OF-A-BIATCH!

[candyman]

Its weird how they could possibly build the whole rig and drilling system without installing a shut-off valve or the dead-man switch...its almost like they found a way to bypass those systems during the whole operation.

Also why should Obama really get that much blame for this? Sure he is president at the time however it is a horrible accident that nobody saw coming...with Bush we even knew about the hurricane but New Orleans decided to not listen. Unless Obama received a message telling him what was going to happen to the rig its not his fault.

Industrial accidents are messy...sadly nobody think they happen as long as you are careful therefore there are few regulations of policies to help in case of an accident...just alot of panic and conspiracy theories.

How about WE take blame...we are using gas and other petroleum products so they have to try to meet our demand. If you don't try to spread the blame on the proper people you will never find a solution...you are just removing the head but leaving the roots and it will happen again.

[Simon Bar Sinister]

this is going to wreck the Gulf oyster industry - maybe for decades; remember, the lighter petroleum compounds will evaporate and the remainder will sink to the bottom - and potentially lead to comtamination of the Mississippi (think of all the freighters that use that waterway)...but, if it finally leads us to tackle the nuclear fusion challenge once and for all, it will all have been worth it.

goddamn, that was a long sentence!

D:

[Rev.Reverence]

Its weird how they could possibly build the whole rig and drilling system without installing a shut-off valve or the dead-man switch...its almost like they found a way to bypass those systems during the whole operation.

Also why should Obama really get that much blame for this? Sure he is president at the time however it is a horrible accident that nobody saw coming...with Bush we even knew about the hurricane but New Orleans decided to not listen. Unless Obama received a message telling him what was going to happen to the rig its not his fault.

Industrial accidents are messy...sadly nobody think they happen as long as you are careful therefore there are few regulations of policies to help in case of an accident...just alot of panic and conspiracy theories.

How about WE take blame...we are using gas and other petroleum products so they have to try to meet our demand. If you don't try to spread the blame on the proper people you will never find a solution...you are just removing the head but leaving the roots and it will happen again.

WRONG, SIR!

...we ALL should have known that it would happen sooner or later...it did not surprise me in the least...

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

Um... Perhaps I am reading about a different oil rig blowing up. Since when did anyone say this rig didn't have a blow back preventor or emergancy shut off system? They were talking about the failure of the blow back preventor for the last two days in the Congressional hearings. What it didn't have, and what was actually made optional by the 2005 bill, was a a secondary back up shut off valve. What that article also fails to mention is the Acoustic systems fail more often than they work which is why it has never been required.

[candyman]

WRONG, SIR!

...we ALL should have known that it would happen sooner or later...it did not surprise me in the least...

No you still can't really see things like this coming...I meant the specific accident...

Like I said further down on my post industrial accidents are things that people think that we have under control and they will never happen. No it is not surprising that this accident happened for the most part...we just had no warnings. You don't warnings before most industrial accidents unless you look into all the factors that lead up to them and by then it would probably be too late.

This accident can teach us many things...including the fact that you can have as many fail-safes as you want and still have problems.

[phee]

This accident can teach us many things...including the fact that you can have as many fail-safes as you want and still have problems.

Quoted for wisdom.

[Rev.Reverence]

No you still can't really see things like this coming...I meant the specific accident...

Like I said further down on my post industrial accidents are things that people think that we have under control and they will never happen. No it is not surprising that this accident happened for the most part...we just had no warnings. You don't warnings before most industrial accidents unless you look into all the factors that lead up to them and by then it would probably be too late.

This accident can teach us many things...including the fact that you can have as many fail-safes as you want and still have problems.

The collective THEY (gov'ment-what-made-drilling-there-legal, drilling company, corporations owning said oil field) COULD HAVE, in fact, had the methods for clean up 'on the ready', & at least PLANS to clean it up, BEFORE they started drilling..."you have to have bleach & rags to clean a kitchen, before you make a mess of it"...

INSTEAD...we have THEM, & the media running around trying to FIGURE OUT what to do to contain it.

Yes, though, I'ld have to say, they should have known that already..it's basic probability.

[Hellion]

It will be quite awhile for this to be cleaned up.

The damage will cost BP quite a bit to fix.

Us old pharts would remember this accident:

Bhopal India had one of the worst industrial accidents

in the world,it is still contaminated with SEVIN, "methyl-isocyante"to this day

which is one hell of a toxic chemical/pesticide.

Blame Union Carbide.

[candyman]

The collective THEY (gov'ment-what-made-drilling-there-legal, drilling company, corporations owning said oil field) COULD HAVE, in fact, had the methods for clean up 'on the ready', & at least PLANS to clean it up, BEFORE they started drilling..."you have to have bleach & rags to clean a kitchen, before you make a mess of it"...

INSTEAD...we have THEM, & the media running around trying to FIGURE OUT what to do to contain it.

Yes, though, I'ld have to say, they should have known that already..it's basic probability.

This is another case where WE don't demand enough. I don't care what kind of power station it is or what kind of oil or coal related site it is there are stupid regulations that turn things into shit. THEY do not care if your house is in the area...the wind generator, solar farm, coal dump, or algae growing field will go wherever they want even if there is too much noise, light, shadow, and the list goes on.

There are clean-up methods in place at all times. However, there is still a problem because your kitchen is usually handled in the same manner while a giant machine that is pumping "earth juices" is going to have so many problems to prepare for that even Data, yep brought Star Trek into this, would have a hard time figuring things out.

Yeah they probably could have been more prepared...but for what? The fact that we know what happened now really changes things but it doesn't help anything before the indecent. Only MacGyver would have been able to handle the situation with the speed that we expect.

[phee]

Only MacGyver would have been able to handle the situation with the speed that we expect.

More Wisdom

[creatureofthenyte]

Allow me to be the one to open a nice can of worms:

http://theweek.com/article/index/202791/gulf-spill-is-the-bush-administration-to-blame

"As a result, Bush's 2005 energy bill, following a Minerals Management Service recommendation, dropped a requirement that oil companies fit every deepwater oil well with a $500,000 "acoustical regulator" — an automatic shut-off switch that could have prevented the BP spill."

I know that I'm sick of the Bush bashing that still goes on these days, However, if the above information is true, then I guess the shoe fits This time.

Edited May 13, 2010 by creatureofthenyte

[Gaf The Horse With Tears]

I know that I'm sick of the Bush bashing that still goes on these days, However, if the above information is true, then I guess the shoe fits This time.

Did you see my post?

[creatureofthenyte]

Did you see my post?

I did now..

[Rev.Reverence]

This is another case where WE don't demand enough. I don't care what kind of power station it is or what kind of oil or coal related site it is there are stupid regulations that turn things into shit. THEY do not care if your house is in the area...the wind generator, solar farm, coal dump, or algae growing field will go wherever they want even if there is too much noise, light, shadow, and the list goes on.

There are clean-up methods in place at all times. However, there is still a problem because your kitchen is usually handled in the same manner while a giant machine that is pumping "earth juices" is going to have so many problems to prepare for that even Data, yep brought Star Trek into this, would have a hard time figuring things out.

Yeah they probably could have been more prepared...but for what? The fact that we know what happened now really changes things but it doesn't help anything before the indecent. Only MacGyver would have been able to handle the situation with the speed that we expect.

Nobody 'demanded enough'...they want 'the easy way'...

..& I still refute, the media are a big bunch of asshats on this one...it happened on the 20th of APRIL...& as of a week ago...these were the headlines, media taking cracks at media:

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/feature/2010/05/05/politics_oil_spill_crude_politics

Gulf Oil Spill

Wednesday, May 5, 2010 20:20 ET

Crude politics spewing from oil rig disaster

The ecological and economic impact of the spill is staggering. But all the media asks is if it's "Obama's Katrina"

More of the same sensationalist bullshite.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5hPxFwKyoLhez0ermEP-qus2pn9uwD9FLT1O82

While some conservative pundits, such as Rush Limbaugh, have called this "Obama's Katrina," that's not how the public feels, the poll found. BP PLC, which owned the well that has gushed more than 4 million gallons since an Apr. 20 oil rig explosion, is getting more of the public's ire....The poll found that 42 percent approve of Obama's actions, 33 percent disapprove and 21 percent say they have neutral feelings about his response.

A Pew Research Center poll in April 2009 found that by 68 percent to 27 percent, people favored "more offshore oil and gas drilling in U.S. waters."

OOO..interesting...

http://www.inthenews.co.uk/news/business/new-evidence-on-oil-rig-disaster-points-to-faulty-valve-$21377429.htm

...UM..DUH.

http://www.glgroup.com/News/Gulf-Oil-Rig-Disaster----Grossly-Underestimated-Watch-Tanker--MS-River-Traffic-48319.html

1) the situation is actually much worse than we're being led to believe, and 2) there could be more extensive than regional dire to potentially catastrophic consequences.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703339304575240513356154980.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_MIDDLENexttoWhatsNewsSecond

Six in 10 respondents to a survey carried out from May 6 to May 10 said they backed more drilling for oil off the U.S. coast. Some 34% said they "strongly" supported it, and 26% said they supported it "somewhat."

More than half of respondents —53%—also said they agreed with the statement that "the potential benefits to the economy outweigh the potential harm to the environment." Respondents in Gulf states were slightly more likely to support additional drilling offshore, with 63% of them saying they would approve of more rigs. The poll has a margin of error of 3.1 percentage points.

I'm not for, nor against drilling...

...I am against stupidity, & destroying the planet before we get to hand it down to the next generation (& I am all about fish dinner for less than $50 a plate).....I'm saying, they should have had a way to close this leak, before they cut the hole...you CAN blast it shut...but, from what I understand, that'll destroy the well, & they spent so much time & money doing it, they want to save the hole...fuck that, I say...blast it, & start cleaning, & get to starting again...they really could have laid charges before drilling, so if there was fail-safes that failed (HAHAHA) they could just shut the hole as soon as the leak happened........to bad......the whole world could be destroyed from this 1 grab at power...

Ewige Blumenkraft und ewige Schlangenkraft!

[phee]

Nobody 'demanded enough'...they want 'the easy way'...

..& I still refute, the media are a big bunch of asshats on this one...it happened on the 20th of APRIL...& as of a week ago...these were the headlines, media taking cracks at media:

http://www.salon.com..._crude_politics

More of the same sensationalist bullshite.

http://www.google.co...2pn9uwD9FLT1O82

OOO..interesting...

http://www.inthenews...e-$21377429.htm

...UM..DUH.

http://www.glgroup.c...ffic-48319.html

http://online.wsj.co...WhatsNewsSecond

I'm not for, nor against drilling...

...I am against stupidity, & destroying the planet before we get to hand it down to the next generation (& I am all about fish dinner for less than $50 a plate).....I'm saying, they should have had a way to close this leak, before they cut the hole...you CAN blast it shut...but, from what I understand, that'll destroy the well, & they spent so much time & money doing it, they want to save the hole...fuck that, I say...blast it, & start cleaning, & get to starting again...they really could have laid charges before drilling, so if there was fail-safes that failed (HAHAHA) they could just shut the hole as soon as the leak happened........to bad......the whole world could be destroyed from this 1 grab at power...

Ewige Blumenkraft und ewige Schlangenkraft!

Thank you for the links sir *bows*

[Rev.Reverence]

Thank you for the links sir *bows*

*bow*

[Msterbeau]

Um... Perhaps I am reading about a different oil rig blowing up. Since when did anyone say this rig didn't have a blow back preventor or emergancy shut off system? They were talking about the failure of the blow back preventor for the last two days in the Congressional hearings. What it didn't have, and what was actually made optional by the 2005 bill, was a a secondary back up shut off valve. What that article also fails to mention is the Acoustic systems fail more often than they work which is why it has never been required.

Do you have a link to the reliability statistics?

http://www.nytimes.com/gwire/2010/05/04/04greenwire-warnings-on-backup-systems-for-oil-rigs-sounde-30452.html

In this article from the NYT, they allude to it being expensive and there being "insufficient data" about it's reliability in certain circumstances. That's not the same as "systems fail more often than they work". I'm imagining that it's tough to get the data since that would be either very expensive or the testing conditions are hard to simulate. That being the case, should there still not have been a mandated secondary form of shut-off valve? Judging by what I read, that's both a necessary and prudent thing to do given the nature of the circumstances under which these kinds of drilling platforms operate. Oh... but wait. That would take away from Dick Cheney's profits at Haliburton. The company that just happens to operate the drilling rig that blew up...

And if they're so awful, why do two other major offshore oil producing nations, Brazil and Norway, require them and use them?

[Rev.Reverence]

Do you have a link to the reliability statistics?

http://www.nytimes.com/gwire/2010/05/04/04greenwire-warnings-on-backup-systems-for-oil-rigs-sounde-30452.html

In this article from the NYT, they allude to it being expensive and there being "insufficient data" about it's reliability in certain circumstances. That's not the same as "systems fail more often than they work". I'm imagining that it's tough to get the data since that would be either very expensive or the testing conditions are hard to simulate. That being the case, should there still not have been a mandated secondary form of shut-off valve? Judging by what I read, that's both a necessary and prudent thing to do given the nature of the circumstances under which these kinds of drilling platforms operate. Oh... but wait. That would take away from Dick Cheney's profits at Haliburton. The company that just happens to operate the drilling rig that blew up...

And if they're so awful, why do two other major offshore oil producing nations, Brazil and Norway, require them and use them?

AHHHH....it all gets clearer & clearer...good digging!

[phee]

I just wish people would stop blaming each other and FIX THE DAMN ISSUE!