Building Relationships/Community - My Last Interaction with Troy

[Marblez]

This is the last interaction that I had with Troy.  In his attempts to gather people together, it was not about the gathering itself, or a narcissistic need for attention. It was about people and opportunities to interact.  He remembered something I had said years ago and realized what it truly meant. Unfortunately, he never saw my reply. But he got it. And I am sharing it with you, hoping that everyone who reads this takes the opportunity to get past the superficial "I was there". Really get in there, take the time to be there FOR and WITH  one another, not just to occupy the same general space and call it good enough.

 

[Scary Guy]

Every Sunday I go to J's shop to watch movies and hang out.  Half the time I'm annoyed because I can't watch the movie because we are all talking and I can't focus on both.  The conversation is always more important though because I know I can always watch the movie later.

 

I mean to a degree it's a bit of selfishness.  I'm selfish too, because I want to hang out with all my friends and have them be friends with eachother.  I like to see a growing community with as little drama as possible (though that will always happen eventually and hopefully it doesn't blow it apart.)

 

A friend sent me this the other day:

 

Troy had his own issues that unfortunately pushed many people away.  I still considered him a friend and tried to be there for him if/when I could.  I think he respected me, but that it did annoy him that I wasn't all about The Gathering and whatnot, and that I always just kind of did my own thing instead.  I've also never really felt like I was a part of the DG.N "in crowd" and never felt it was my place to take a more active role here.  Not to mention there was that one time I got banned for a few years for speaking my mind.  I was really only unbanned after the site was already on the decline.  But when you have many people threatening to leave over one guy it's really not a hard choice to make (and also I was an asshole, but you can be an asshole and still be right too.)

 

I also know many miss when The Gathering was just about goth nerd stuff and not focused on BDSM sex stuff (although when I did go the focus was still mostly nerd stuff AFAICT.)

 

He blamed MySpace and Facebook for killing off this forum, but we all know it wasn't just that.  Then he shifted to Discord and did pretty well there I thought (though I didn't see many hanging out in the voice chat and it could have used a music bot.)

 

I've never been one for hero worship, postmortem or otherwise.  I'm not going to blow smoke and say he was perfect because he wasn't, and none of us are.  He did try to be a good person as best he could though.  I do wish I talked with him more even though we didn't see eye to eye on some things, I think we had common ground on most things.

 

 I am reminded specifically of this scene: 

 

Many grew apart from him personally over the years but benefited and were a part of the community that he built here.  Helping to unify people was one of the best things he ever did, and I hope this site continues to do that for years to come, for all goths and people in general from near and far that happen to find their way here.

 

As always things are...  complicated.

[Fierce Critter]

I last saw Troy in person Halloween 2019. I was dressed in costume for work, but had nowhere to go after. I was quite the homebody by that point, so going out didn't happen much. But I wanted to do SOMETHING. So I finally went to a Gathering.

Troy didn't recognize me initially because I had a wig on and it had been at least a decade since we'd seen each other in person. When he did, we hugged warmly, and took a great photo together. I'd forgotten how tall he was. I bought him dinner (a chicken finger platter was his choice). It was the first time I met Bobbi in person, and I'm grateful for that.

He and I spoke through DM's here and there over the years. He'd ask me for advice on things like DGN and his efforts to build a YouTube channel. He rarely took it, lol. But I appreciated that he at least reached out to me for my take on things.

I never had particularly bad interactions with him as many have shared. He lashed out at me a couple times but it was over misunderstandings on his part, and he apologized. So I'll count myself lucky.

Like others, I credit Troy with creating DGN and therefore broadening my circle of friends/acquaintances. And also giving me a way to connect with others when I moved out of state and then up north, and was very lonely due to location and a really bad marriage. DGN dumped it's share of drama in my lap, so I quit when it became more negative than positive. But I'm still in contact both virtual and in-person with people who I wouldn't have in my life were it not for Troy.

So thanks, Troy Spiral. 

[Anna Phylaxis]

I don’t even know exactly how many years it’s been since I’ve seen, Troy, in person. I think that it was at Angel and Wreckie’s wedding. I don’t come out much because it’s just a little too peopley for me sometimes. Every so often, I’ll make an appearance at Smalls. It’s always a nice little group, and it makes me happy to see those faces.
 

He and I had a falling out, several years ago. The crazy thing is that I don’t know what it was about. I came here to visit and socialize and see who was here. What I got was a verbal attack that I never saw coming. Several people stood up for me and I just stopped coming. 

 

He eventually apologized, in his own way. I think he was embarrassed. But the reality is that if DGN didn’t exist, I wouldn’t be here at all. I would probably still be back home, living a miserable life, because I just wasn’t thriving there. DGN brought me some awesome friends, a wonderful husband, even my job. I don’t know how my life would be if it wasn’t for this place. This community has given me a lot without even trying hard. 

 

The community, here, is something I brag about, often. When people ask me how I met Jeff, I told them all about this place. It has given me a lot.

[Scary Guy]

40 minutes ago, Anna Phylaxis said:

I don’t even know exactly how many years it’s been since I’ve seen, Troy, in person. I think that it was at Angel and Wreckie’s wedding. I don’t come out much because it’s just a little too peopley for me sometimes. Every so often, I’ll make an appearance at Smalls. It’s always a nice little group, and it makes me happy to see those faces.
 

He and I had a falling out, several years ago. The crazy thing is that I don’t know what it was about. I came here to visit and socialize and see who was here. What I got was a verbal attack that I never saw coming. Several people stood up for me and I just stopped coming. 

 

He eventually apologized, in his own way. I think he was embarrassed. But the reality is that if DGN didn’t exist, I wouldn’t be here at all. I would probably still be back home, living a miserable life, because I just wasn’t thriving there. DGN brought me some awesome friends, a wonderful husband, even my job. I don’t know how my life would be if it wasn’t for this place. This community has given me a lot without even trying hard. 

 

The community, here, is something I brag about, often. When people ask me how I met Jeff, I told them all about this place. It has given me a lot.

Troy created it, and funded much of it.  I think it still exists partly because it wants to though.  If Troy hadn't passed we'd still be poking along doing our own thing and checking in every so often with very little activity.

Like minded people will come together and form hubs though.  This one is targeted toward goths who live in or around the Metro Detroit area.  If it didn't exist something else would to fill that void.  Perhaps that other forum would still be around, or a Failbook group, or even a forum like this one but started by someone else and called something different.

I'm still sad that we've lost a lot of users over the years, some that I liked, and even the more annoying ones.  I'm thankful for everyone who decided to stick around though, and those that decided to come back.

As far as him apologizing, pride and a fear of being wrong (especially publicly) often limits our ability to do so.  That in turn limits our ability to maintain the friendships attached to those transgressions, however minor those may be.  It takes a big person to admit they were wrong, and another to accept that admission and move on.

[Anna Phylaxis]

13 hours ago, Scary Guy said:

Troy created it, and funded much of it.  I think it still exists partly because it wants to though.  If Troy hadn't passed we'd still be poking along doing our own thing and checking in every so often with very little activity.

Like minded people will come together and form hubs though.  This one is targeted toward goths who live in or around the Metro Detroit area.  If it didn't exist something else would to fill that void.  Perhaps that other forum would still be around, or a Failbook group, or even a forum like this one but started by someone else and called something different.

I'm still sad that we've lost a lot of users over the years, some that I liked, and even the more annoying ones.  I'm thankful for everyone who decided to stick around though, and those that decided to come back.

As far as him apologizing, pride and a fear of being wrong (especially publicly) often limits our ability to do so.  That in turn limits our ability to maintain the friendships attached to those transgressions, however minor those may be.  It takes a big person to admit they were wrong, and another to accept that admission and move on.

What’s so wild about this to me is the fact that, even though the huge, main group that was here, when I came in are gone, this board is still moving along. I have peaked in, on and off, over the years. And Tron is doing a fucking phenomenal job. I’d love to help rebuild it, somehow. I just know that it’s because of this place, and these people that I uprooted my entire life to move from Baltimore, Maryland to Detroit, Michigan. 

 

I have zero regrets. And even if something happened to my marriage, this is my home now. I could move back east, but why? I’m absolutely thriving here. And it’s all either directly or indirectly because of something Troy did. I just feel so damn fortunate and it’s just so nice to be here.

[Bean2.0]

Troy never did anything wrong to me, personally. He was always nice to me. But, I witnessed some of his behaviors towards others and have heard things from people I know have no reason to make things up. We all have our demons. I did some really shitty things in the past that I still feel guilty and shameful for, but it's a reminder to never go back to being that person again. To continue working on being a better person. 

 

I'm thankful for this site, because my life would have gone in a different direction had I not stumbled upon DGN. TBH I probably wouldn't be alive right now. Meeting my husband here completely changed my life in so many positive ways. The friends I've made because of this place has changed my life for the positive. I am incredibly shy and awkward, and my social anxiety was absolutely horrible when I was younger. DGN made it a little easier for me to meet others. I am grateful. 

[gwen]

well i liked troy. he was a sweetheart.

[NocteSpiritus]

On 5/24/2023 at 1:33 AM, Scary Guy said:

Troy had his own issues that unfortunately pushed many people away.  I still considered him a friend and tried to be there for him if/when I could.  I think he respected me, but that it did annoy him that I wasn't all about The Gathering and whatnot, and that I always just kind of did my own thing instead.  I've also never really felt like I was a part of the DG.N "in crowd" and never felt it was my place to take a more active role here.  Not to mention there was that one time I got banned for a few years for speaking my mind.  I was really only unbanned after the site was already on the decline.  But when you have many people threatening to leave over one guy it's really not a hard choice to make (and also I was an asshole, but you can be an asshole and still be right too.)

 

I also know many miss when The Gathering was just about goth nerd stuff and not focused on BDSM sex stuff (although when I did go the focus was still mostly nerd stuff AFAICT.)

 

He blamed MySpace and Facebook for killing off this forum, but we all know it wasn't just that.  Then he shifted to Discord and did pretty well there I thought (though I didn't see many hanging out in the voice chat and it could have used a music bot.)

 

As always things are...  complicated.

 

I'm in the same boat as others here where I considered him a friend, but he pushed away due to some reason or another. I don't know if he ever respected me, especially after what I call "The Fall Out" where he accused me of things without any sort of proof. 

 

I do miss the nerdy Gathering.

 

The Discord server, prior to me being booted, was doing well.

[Scary Guy]

1 hour ago, NocteSpiritus said:

 

I'm in the same boat as others here where I considered him a friend, but he pushed away due to some reason or another. I don't know if he ever respected me, especially after what I call "The Fall Out" where he accused me of things without any sort of proof. 

 

I do miss the nerdy Gathering.

 

The Discord server, prior to me being booted, was doing well.

I heard a lot of people say Troy reached out to them prior to everything.  He never contacted me though so that's made me reevaluate things and maybe the friendship was only one sided because I rarely went to The Gathering and I didn't do the whole "father Troy" cult worshiping that he wanted.

I left the Discord of my own volition (prior to me leaving the platform completely) because someone deleted a post of mine without good reason and didn't let me know.  I can abide many things but putting words in my mouth and removing those words without telling my why (especially when in my view it wasn't bad in any way) are two things I can't stand.

Also, as I told @Maureen Falcon he's gone now and you can go back.  It's really unfortunate he pushed so many away over the years.  Maybe the site wouldn't be as dead as it was.  The whole gearing House Spiral toward a fetish/BDSM thing didn't help any with that either.  I'm glad it's in recovery though.

 

 

10 hours ago, gwen said:

well i liked troy. he was a sweetheart.

 

He had his moments for sure as he wasn't all bad, and if he was I wouldn't have continued to associate with him.

[Stu]

I find it best to remember the good stuff.  The past is past.  While I was sad that there was a rift between Troy and my Moe, I never forgot that he was the one to step up and visit her in the hospital when I could not.  He did that despite his misgivings about the distance, how well his car was running at the time, gas and on and on.  What could've been... well... it's futility now to speculate and only compounds our grief.  True story.

[gwen]

ppl push ppl away out of mental health issues. like i said, sweetheart.

i had ONE friend and ONE family member come see me in the hospital when I almost died. It means, SO MUCH. 

 

[Scary Guy]

I had two friends visit me when I was in years ago.  One I don't talk to and the other we actively hate each other now because drama.

To be clear I don't push people away because of mental health, I push them away because they are assholes (or annoying sometimes, but I try not to let that affect my judgement of them.)  I mean I'm sure some relationships broke down because of my mental health issues, but I wasn't actively trying to accomplish that state.

[Raev]

I don't push people away, I just struggle to connect in the first place. Terribly socially awkward in initial meetings. 

[Scary Guy]

41 minutes ago, Raev said:

I don't push people away, I just struggle to connect in the first place. Terribly socially awkward in initial meetings. 

 

Okay well...  that too.

 

Sometimes that takes years, if ever.  But at that point it's also kind of on them for not wanting to put in the effort.

Though sometimes that's because they're socially awkward as well.

[NocteSpiritus]

19 hours ago, Scary Guy said:

I heard a lot of people say Troy reached out to them prior to everything.  He never contacted me though so that's made me reevaluate things and maybe the friendship was only one sided because I rarely went to The Gathering and I didn't do the whole "father Troy" cult worshiping that he wanted.

I left the Discord of my own volition (prior to me leaving the platform completely) because someone deleted a post of mine without good reason and didn't let me know.  I can abide many things but putting words in my mouth and removing those words without telling my why (especially when in my view it wasn't bad in any way) are two things I can't stand.

Also, as I told @Maureen Falcon he's gone now and you can go back.  It's really unfortunate he pushed so many away over the years.  Maybe the site wouldn't be as dead as it was.  The whole gearing House Spiral toward a fetish/BDSM thing didn't help any with that either.  I'm glad it's in recovery though.

 

 

 

He had his moments for sure as he wasn't all bad, and if he was I wouldn't have continued to associate with him.

 

Troy did reach out to me; I can't say the same for others he's had issues with (like with Moe). He did have his good moments. I was kicked from discord due to the fall out. I would like to go back, but I'd have to ask. Troy felt bad for our riff, but made no means of communication prior to his death. 

For all he and I butted heads, I never wished him ill will or harm. That he would get the help he desperately needed.

 

16 hours ago, Stu said:

I find it best to remember the good stuff.  The past is past.  While I was sad that there was a rift between Troy and my Moe, I never forgot that he was the one to step up and visit her in the hospital when I could not.  He did that despite his misgivings about the distance, how well his car was running at the time, gas and on and on.  What could've been... well... it's futility now to speculate and only compounds our grief.  True story.

 

That's a good way to do it; remember the good stuff.

 

11 hours ago, Raev said:

I don't push people away, I just struggle to connect in the first place. Terribly socially awkward in initial meetings. 

 

Same in a way with making the connection. 

[torn asunder]

On 6/15/2023 at 7:13 AM, Raev said:

I don't push people away, I just struggle to connect in the first place. Terribly socially awkward in initial meetings. 

 

same...

[Scary Guy]

On 6/15/2023 at 11:13 AM, Raev said:

I don't push people away, I just struggle to connect in the first place. Terribly socially awkward in initial meetings. 

 

On 6/15/2023 at 11:58 AM, Scary Guy said:

Okay well...  that too.

 

On 6/15/2023 at 11:01 PM, NocteSpiritus said:

Same in a way with making the connection. 

 

3 hours ago, torn asunder said:

 

same...

Yeah, that's what I like about our community.  It's a social club for anti-social awkward people.  Though even then it can often be hard connecting.  I don't know many of you as well as I'd like to, and the other 90% no longer come around to know anyway.