Computer Music software/hardware

[Fierce Critter]

Been wanting to do this for a while now, and have a moment to do so.

I'd like this thread to be a catch-all of commentary, review, etc. on primarily software used to create music on computer - VSTI's, mixers, editors, etc.

There's room for some hardware discussion such as USB mic interfaces (i.e., M-Audio Fast Track), USB keyboards (i.e., eKeys), headphones, monitors, etc. But primarily I'd like to see commentary/discussion/reviews/questions about software.

I'll post a response to show what I mean. =)

[Fierce Critter]

Right now, I'm using Cubase as my primary mixer program, Cool Edit Pro for tweaking things like vocal tracks, GoldWave for manipulating wav files (such as rain, thunder).

For hardware, I'm currently using an eKeys USB keyboard, an M-Audio Fast Track to get vocals/guitar into the computer, and Roland MA-8 monitors.

But I'm excited to share about some VSTI's I've discovered lately.

In recording a song for the DGN CD, I wanted to go back to my acoustic roots. But after 8 years of barely touching my guitars, my callouses are gone and I'm rusty as hell. I did some Googling, and found MusicLAB RealGuitar.

OMFG. What an incredible, incredible package. I only have the demo, which only gives you one instrument (steel acoustic), and a fingerful of effects. The actual package costs around $200.

Someday, I will invest in it. The sounds are incredible. You can minipulate everything from the sound of your "fingers" zipping up and down wound strings to pick hit to body thump. It gives you options of using patterns - of which the full program gives you dozens, if not hundreds. Everything from strumming to picking arpeggios.

Anyway, it helped me re-create a song I've performed live since the early 90's. Without it, I don't think I could have re-skilled myself in time to record it for the CD.

For Mother's Day, I decided to grant my mother's request for a recorded copy of me singing Schubert's "Ave Maria". At first, I wanted to find a karaoke version of the instrumental backing track, but I couldn't find it downloadable anywhere (I know it exists, but that's a different topic). Then, I figured I'd try to create it myself in Cubase. Startd to do so, using an actual recording as a guide. That proved tedious, so I started to see if I could Google sheet music for it. I came across a website, 8notes.com, which actually had midi files that broke down the song into downloadable midi files of each instrument's part. You need to check it out.

Anyway, I brought the midi files into Cubase. I wanted to try two different types of instruments - classical strings/woodwinds and pipe organ - for the instrumental. I had already downloaded a trial version of Synful Orchestra. OMG - another great package. I'm not clear on the total capabilities of the full package, but it provided me enough cello, bass, clarinet, flute - whatever I needed for this project. It sounded great.

But I wanted to hear it with a pipe organ - the type I used to hear going to Sweetest Heart of Mary church in Detroit, which has, I believe, the largest pipe organ in Michigan. That's when I did more Googling and found Syntheway Organux.

OMFG again. This package is incredible. Not sure how many sounds the full version has, but the trial version has not one pipe organ, but at least 3 or 4. Everything from a simple church pipe organ to a cathedral style, a baroque, etc. It also includes two types of Hammond B3's, and others. The trial version comes with this very, very nasty sound that hits every 5 seconds or so - it's obnoxious as hell, and does come through on exported wav files. But the actual package runs only around $36, another I'll purchase when budget allows.

Those are my big discoveries for this post. I highly recommend checking out the packages I mentioned.

[Blackmail]

I want to find a USB midi keyboard/controller with 61 full size keys, with tons of knobs/oscillators and I want to find a moog VST that sounds like the real thing.

Or I want to get a midi moog, a real one. I miss using hardware synths and would like to use them but

a. it isn't cost effective

b. with softsynths you have access to tons more sounds

c. editing on a computer is easier and faster and more intuitive

I was reading an interview with Stephen Morris of New Order/Joy Division and they said that in the 80's they would come out with an album every 2 or 3 years because the synths took so long to program. He said that they recorded two albusm worth of material in about 3 months last year because of Cubase and how it sped things up so fast.

Everyone I listen to uses computers now....Depeche Mode, New Order, OMD....all those old bands that helped form the sound of electro pop today have largely abandoned the old synths and use newer technology.

On the other hand I still like the sounds of older electropop records, like Soft Cell's 'non stop eroitc cabaret' which is classic 80's synthpop. There are a few groups still using the early 80's analog sounds like Joy Electric, the Fairlight Children (which is headed by Stephen Groth of Apop) and Anna Ranger. Joy Electric won't go anywhere near a computer. It's all analog with those old Alesis sequencers.

So I don't think one way is better than the other. I like both hardware and software. The Nord modular seems interesting, the waldorf microwave looks cool too. I do miss my old Novation bass station.

I'll tell you one thing, sampling on a computer is far better than a standalone sampler, I used to have an Ensoniq ESI32 and it would take hours to edit the samples how I wanted them. Now it's a breeze using recycle or something like that.

[Rayne]

I'm limited on my stuff.

I have Nero SoundTrax. I also have Fruity Loops and Cakewalk on here ... but I don't know how to use either of them. Fruity Loops is demo. I haven't really sat down to figure it out.

As far as instruments/hardware ... I have none. I use a Logitech headset/mic. I'm so primitive ... but I do have all of Phee's equipment at my disposal, here in the studio if I ever choose to learn how to use any of it.

[phee]

I use Cakewalk to control my hardware... I have never been a fan of "softsynth"

[Blackmail]

I use Cakewalk to control my hardware... I have never been a fan of "softsynth"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

neither was I until a couple of years ago when they started sounding as good as the real ones. All the early soft synths sounded like garbage, most were made with synthedit.

[phee]

neither was I until a couple of years ago when they started sounding as good as the real ones.  All the early soft synths sounded like garbage, most were made with synthedit.

Interesting...

You know, I think my problem is I have been listening to so much "canned club" music and I need to start listening to other newer artists that are using soft synth in a non repeatative 4 on the floor way... (no problem with that kind of music, I think I have just been overloaded)

[Fierce Critter]

Before this thread goes any further, I'd like discussion regarding certain methods of obtaining software - you know what I mean - to either find it's way to a different thread altogether, or kept private.

Debate/admonishment/judgment I'd like kept out of this thread altogether. If the subject comes up, I'd prefer the subject be continued in PM's between interested parties.

We all feel one way or the other, and some in-between on the subject of downloading, file sharing, warez, etc. I don't want that to be an issue here. Alrighty? =)

[Fierce Critter]

...I want to find a moog VST that sounds like the real thing. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Arturia Mood Modular

I have this. Full version. Contact me privately regarding details. =)

[Rayne]

Before this thread goes any further, I'd like discussion regarding certain methods of obtaining software - you know what I mean - to either find it's way to a different thread altogether, or kept private. =)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think this was referring to me ... no big deal ... but I amended my post.

[Fierce Critter]

I think this was referring to me ... no big deal ... but I amended my post.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually, no it wasn't - not at all. =)

It was a preface to my own thread which came immediately after. I meant to make such a reference when I first started the thread, but I was making one of my rare attempts at being brief. :grin

Frankly, I'm a functional paranoid. I don't know what thought police are at work anywhere, anytime. I don't like to leave myself open to their whims.

I would love to leave personal expression open about such matters. I'm not a mod, so it's not like I can absolutely control it, you know? But I just wanted to, if anything, suggest that it might be best to leave direct mention of such things to private means.

[Steven]

you guys are the coolest.

i dont know how to do any of this stuff (record to computer).

Pretty much all I can do is write melodies and lyrics and sing.

I own a 12 string guitar, its an el cheapo that is murder on the fingers but it does sound wonderful on teh three chords I know.

And I once had a beautiful sexy Red semi hollowbody electric but I was out of work and had bills to pay so off it went to hockville. I'm still in therapy over that one.

maybe one day I can hang with one of y'all and see how this gizmotronic stuff works......

[phee]

Thanks Steven... you rawk...

I play a mean Didgeridoo.... also... um yeah

[odims_sphere]

I miss using hardware synths and would like to use them but

a. it isn't cost effective

b. with softsynths you have access to tons more sounds

c. editing on a computer is easier and faster and more intuitive

A. you are right, soft synths are way cheaper than Hardware synths

B. Well... yes and no. older synths that have no memory or importing capibility are definatly beat by today's soft synths, but modern hardware can access memory in the same way a computer can, so really the sounds are limited by ones storage capacity, the same as soft synths. Each of my K2000's have a 1gig hard drive in them and I use an external back-up hard drive for even more storage.

C. I personally find hardware editing for sound design faster on hardware synths. It's all at my finger tips and I don't have to look for the menu I need to bring up the specific parameter that I want to edit. For wave editing and sequencing I'd agree software is the way to go. I'll actually record an entire movie on minidisc, dump it to a computer for chopping, editing and normalizing, then keymap it to the K2000 for use in the song I'm working on.

I do miss my old Novation bass station.

I bought one once and I agree the sounds were awesome, but We couldn't get it to work right with Cakewalk. I don't know if I got a defective one, or if it's a compatibility issue but Marc and I worked on it for weeks trying to figure it out without success. It would occasionally drop notes... like midi lag, (or processer lag for you soft synth people out there ). But no other piece of gear we had would do it running on the same exact midi channel. I was sad when I had to send it back, but then I got the Pro one and all was well.

The Novation drum station was awesome as well for that real analog classic 808 and 909 sound.

I'll tell you one thing, sampling on a computer is far better than a standalone sampler, I used to have an Ensoniq ESI32 and it would take hours to edit the samples how I wanted them.  Now it's a breeze using recycle or something like that.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I've never had a lot of luck sampling directly into the computer, but I've never really looked in to doing it right either. For editing a sample I agree with you 100% the computer is the place for it, but I haven't met a computer yet that I can't crash simply by writing a song using soft synths and plugin effects with straight midi key on key off messages. I tried soft synths once and I had to keep rendering tracks to wav files to play back as loops to save CPU power, then later if I wanted to change anything I had to bring up the old file of the source material, make the change, re-render it to a wav file and re-import it into the song. I was running a P4 3.6Ghz with 1gig of ram. If that's not enough then something is definatly wrong.

[detroitrequiem]

We use:

Fl Studio 6

Cubase SX

Zeta, Sytrus, Absynth 2-3, Superwave synths, WASP, Vanguard, Microtonic, most VST soft synths that are out

Waves mastering tools like the Q10, Rbass, etc

I use a M audio soundcard with event monitors, Norm uses some new $1500. card I cant remember and his roland monitors

CME midi controllers

roland 1880 at times

our drummer is buying a roland drum kit I believe for our live shows

akg c3000b mic for recording

mostly digital these days....

[Pulse State]

There's a new one from Rob Papen (made sounds for at least a couple iterations of the Access Virus, also worked with Linplug to make Albino and Albino 2) called Blue. If you get can Blue, it has some killer sounds and synth loops in it! I just recently got it and am still experimenting with sounds.

EDIT: ReFX Vanguard is good, especially for layering with other sounds, but unfortunately that has become one of the most overused softsynths in EBM/synth/&c music today. I still proudly use it because I like the sounds, but keep that in mind if you're going to make a whole song based on the first few presets.

[Soulrev]

Reason 3.0, the best 500 bucks I ever spent. Well except that one time, in Amst.. nevermind.. :D

Hey Blackmail, I'm almost positive M-Audio does make a couple of different 61 key USB keyboards. I'm happy with the Oxygen 8 though.

[Soulrev]

Trent Reznor does everything with a computer first. I read that in REMIX like 6 months ago they did an interview with him.

[Blackmail]

I really don't like to talk about which VST's I use. I don't want people using the same sounds as me, even if I edit them heavily.

Same with hardware synths. My friend got a Korg 01 back in 1995 so I got a Roland Xp50. Another friend got a MC303 groovebox so i got a Novation bass station.

I will say that I wish I could afford Reason, it seems to be awesome.

[Soulrev]

Sell a couple pieces of hardware cuz you won't need 'em anymore anyways