Be Reasonable!

[Troy Spiral (13)]

BE REASONABLE!

Ever hear this? But when was the last time anyone actually broke down what "being reasonable" means? Ever have a class in critical thinking?

A collection of quick examples of poor reasoning. There are long discussions of each of these (and latin names for them all) but just a brief reminder of the key idea of each.

1. Unreasonable Generalization

Broad statements based on irrelevant, or inaccurate evidence.

Example: Of course our students are physically fit; just look at the success of our sports teams this year.

2. Faulty Cause and Effect Reasoning (Post Hoc)

Post Hoc arguments are assuming that because B follows A, A must be the cause of B.

Example: Tourism in this city started to decline right after Mayor Scott was elected. To save our tourist industry, let's replace her now!

3. Reductive Reasoning

Over simplification. Reduces a complex effect to a single cause.

Example: People who want to be healthy should eat turnips. My Aunt Alice loved turnips, and she lived to be ninety-four.

4. False Analogies

Writers overlook the fact that two things being compared are more different than they are similar. There are tons of different types of these.

Example: Why am I required to take certain courses before I can graduate from this school? No one requires me to buy certain groceries before I can leave the supermarket.

5. Begging (Avoiding) The Question

Similar to circular reasoning begging the question occurs when a writer assumes as true the very point he or she is arguing.

Example: Improving public transportation in this city won't solve highway congestion. Even if public transportation is clean, safe, and efficient, people will still prefer to use their cars.

6. Circular Reasoning

The argument merely restates the conclusion it was meant to support maybe with slightly different language.

Example: The minister is such a good person because she is so virtuous.

7. Equivocation

Equivocation involves using a term in a completely different way than one's opponent uses it. Usually to two or more interpretations and usually used to mislead or confuse and/or make into a joke.

Example: My goodness, your honor! It is absurd that I am being prosecuted for stealing a copy of the Detroit Free Press. For one thing, we are guaranteed by the Constitution our right to a free press. And look at the name of this newspaper—does it not say Free Press?

8. Ad Hominem Arguments

Ad Hominem Arguments attack the opponent rather than his or her argument. (Ad hominem literally means "against the person.") This one is so common that you almost are forced to make sure you cover it in your discussion because people just automatically start thinking "ok so this guy is saying X... what does he do personally?" Often its better to just deal with this one rather than try to convince people that they are making this error.

Example: Senator Jones' bill on gun control should not be taken seriously; after all, this is the same man who has had at least five extramarital affairs.

9. False Either/Or Arguments

These assume that only two alternatives exist in a given situation.

Example: The case is clear: either we support the death penalty or we allow crime to run rampant.

10. Band Wagon Appeals

Band wagon appeals suggest that readers should accept something because it is popular; that is, everyone else has "hopped on the bandwagon."

Example: A recent poll showed that seventy percent of the American public believes emissions requirements on automobiles have gone too far; therefore, these laws are unreasonable and should be repealed.

11. Non Sequiturs

Non-Sequiturs occur when writers fail to show clear connections between their premise (starting point) and conclusion. (Non sequitur literally means "it does not follow.")

Example: Maria loved college, so I'm sure she will make an excellent teacher.

12. Red Herring

This means exactly what you think it means: introducing irrelevant facts or arguments to distract from the question at hand.

Example, "The opposition claims that welfare dependency leads to higher crime rates -- but how are poor people supposed to keep a roof over their heads without our help?"

12. Straw Man

Straw man. This is the fallacy of refuting a caricatured or extreme version of somebody's argument, rather than the actual argument they've made.

Example: "Mr. Jones thinks that capitalism is good because everybody earns whatever wealth they have, but this is clearly false because many people just inherit their fortunes," when in fact Mr. Jones had not made the "earnings" argument and had instead argued, say, that capitalism gives most people an incentive to work and save. The fact that some arguments made for a policy are wrong does not imply that the policy itself is wrong.

13. You Too! (Tu quoque)

This is the fallacy of defending an error in one's reasoning by pointing out that one's opponent has made the same error. An error is still an error, regardless of how many people make it.

For example, "They accuse us of making unjustified assertions. But they asserted a lot of things, too!"

14. Appeal To Tradtion

The argument that some policy, behavior, or practice is right or acceptable because "it's always been done that way."

Example:"Every great civilization in history has provided state subsidies for art and culture!" But that fact does not in and of itself justify continuing the policy.

There are tons more and they all have fancy latin names. Just a list i put together for... some reason. Well this stuff is important! We are told that we should "think clearly" and often have no real clear understanding of what the hell that means.

Most of the examples conclusions could be argued ... its the REASONING thats poor.

[Troy Spiral (13)]

ignore this post.

[Msterbeau]

Too late.

[Onyx]

Can't. I already read the whole thing.

We need more logic and reason in this world.

[Homicidalheathen]

ignore this post.

Ok

[Scary Guy]

.

Edited October 14, 2016 by Scary Guy
The link I posted died, editing it out.

[Scary Guy]

double post

Edited May 10, 2007 by Scary Guy

[Msterbeau]

I ignored this post once. It was great.

[Troy Spiral (13)]

Nothing new here, but it would be fairly earth shattering for some. Unfortunately the people that this stuff would most benefit are exactly the folks that wouldn't bother to look into it.

Just stuff no one bothers with, because well... I need to watch the next episode of American Idol or hear someone screw up an intelligent point by reducing it to some dumb ass joke.

We grow up assuming (i hope) that "rational thought" is important, but we are never told what rational thought actually consists of and how to think critically. We are just supposed to pick it up along the way.

Then when we have vast swaths of people with really asinine belief systems we wonder how anyone could think so badly.

Having recently started studying logic / critical thinking its amazing how many GIANT fucking holes I've found in my own thinking that i didn't even realize where there.

I've come to the conclusion that i need to put some of the things I'm looking into on the back burner until i research actually how thinking/studying can go wrong right off the bat, just due to poor reasoning. Its not something we just "pick up" and automatically know. Its a subject in and of itself.

[BrassFusion]

the troy is a rare bird

[Sybil]

BE REASONABLE!

Ever hear this? But when was the last time anyone actually broke down what "being reasonable" means? Ever have a class in critical thinking?

A collection of quick examples of poor reasoning. There are long discussions of each of these (and latin names for them all) but just a brief reminder of the key idea of each.

1. Unreasonable Generalization

Broad statements based on irrelevant, or inaccurate evidence.

Example: Of course our students are physically fit; just look at the success of our sports teams this year.

2. Faulty Cause and Effect Reasoning (Post Hoc)

Post Hoc arguments are assuming that because B follows A, A must be the cause of B.

Example: Tourism in this city started to decline right after Mayor Scott was elected. To save our tourist industry, let's replace her now!

3. Reductive Reasoning

Over simplification. Reduces a complex effect to a single cause.

Example: People who want to be healthy should eat turnips. My Aunt Alice loved turnips, and she lived to be ninety-four.

4. False Analogies

Writers overlook the fact that two things being compared are more different than they are similar. There are tons of different types of these.

Example: Why am I required to take certain courses before I can graduate from this school? No one requires me to buy certain groceries before I can leave the supermarket.

5. Begging (Avoiding) The Question

Similar to circular reasoning begging the question occurs when a writer assumes as true the very point he or she is arguing.

Example: Improving public transportation in this city won't solve highway congestion. Even if public transportation is clean, safe, and efficient, people will still prefer to use their cars.

6. Circular Reasoning

The argument merely restates the conclusion it was meant to support maybe with slightly different language.

Example: The minister is such a good person because she is so virtuous.

7. Equivocation

Equivocation involves using a term in a completely different way than one's opponent uses it. Usually to two or more interpretations and usually used to mislead or confuse and/or make into a joke.

Example: My goodness, your honor! It is absurd that I am being prosecuted for stealing a copy of the Detroit Free Press. For one thing, we are guaranteed by the Constitution our right to a free press. And look at the name of this newspaper—does it not say Free Press?

8. Ad Hominem Arguments

Ad Hominem Arguments attack the opponent rather than his or her argument. (Ad hominem literally means "against the person.") This one is so common that you almost are forced to make sure you cover it in your discussion because people just automatically start thinking "ok so this guy is saying X... what does he do personally?" Often its better to just deal with this one rather than try to convince people that they are making this error.

Example: Senator Jones' bill on gun control should not be taken seriously; after all, this is the same man who has had at least five extramarital affairs.

9. False Either/Or Arguments

These assume that only two alternatives exist in a given situation.

Example: The case is clear: either we support the death penalty or we allow crime to run rampant.

10. Band Wagon Appeals

Band wagon appeals suggest that readers should accept something because it is popular; that is, everyone else has "hopped on the bandwagon."

Example: A recent poll showed that seventy percent of the American public believes emissions requirements on automobiles have gone too far; therefore, these laws are unreasonable and should be repealed.

11. Non Sequiturs

Non-Sequiturs occur when writers fail to show clear connections between their premise (starting point) and conclusion. (Non sequitur literally means "it does not follow.")

Example: Maria loved college, so I'm sure she will make an excellent teacher.

12. Red Herring

This means exactly what you think it means: introducing irrelevant facts or arguments to distract from the question at hand.

Example, "The opposition claims that welfare dependency leads to higher crime rates -- but how are poor people supposed to keep a roof over their heads without our help?"

12. Straw Man

Straw man. This is the fallacy of refuting a caricatured or extreme version of somebody's argument, rather than the actual argument they've made.

Example: "Mr. Jones thinks that capitalism is good because everybody earns whatever wealth they have, but this is clearly false because many people just inherit their fortunes," when in fact Mr. Jones had not made the "earnings" argument and had instead argued, say, that capitalism gives most people an incentive to work and save. The fact that some arguments made for a policy are wrong does not imply that the policy itself is wrong.

13. You Too! (Tu quoque)

This is the fallacy of defending an error in one's reasoning by pointing out that one's opponent has made the same error. An error is still an error, regardless of how many people make it.

For example, "They accuse us of making unjustified assertions. But they asserted a lot of things, too!"

14. Appeal To Tradtion

The argument that some policy, behavior, or practice is right or acceptable because "it's always been done that way."

Example:"Every great civilization in history has provided state subsidies for art and culture!" But that fact does not in and of itself justify continuing the policy.

There are tons more and they all have fancy latin names. Just a list i put together for... some reason. Well this stuff is important! We are told that we should "think clearly" and often have no real clear understanding of what the hell that means.

Most of the examples conclusions could be argued ... its the REASONING thats poor.

this post made me think of of many times that i threw a statement out of my mouth QUICKLY because i didnt want to take hours/days/weeks to think and hammer out a solution.

ouch, too many times really..

i am going to go back and read this again.

ouch..

emotions fill my thoughts eaSILLY..

and when a person is speaking to me that i DONT AGREE WITH WHO THEY ARE, i have had tendancies to attack them instead of LISTEN TO them and carry on civilized conversation..

a good mirror..

this post is a good mirror.

i am going to read it for a 3rd time.

Edited June 10, 2007 by Sybil

[Troy Spiral (13)]

Well in a lot of the "Evolution Vs. Creation" books i started reading ages ago they would introduce a lot of these ideas when trying to argue for/against things. Philosophy books love this stuff because it makes it easier to actually have a decent conversation instead of just going around and around. Its cool when your talking to someone that actually understands at least some of this stuff, much easier to get to the point of things.

These "logic errors" are nice because they don't take a year long course in critical thinking to grasp. There is actual "critical thinking" books that i have, but i'd not recommend them for people new to the ideas, as the shit is some heavy ass reading.

Having said all that, this site here:

www.fallacyfiles.org

Has a great error list , with pretty cool examples so you can see the logic in action. On the left is all the common names of the fallacies , then on the right is the explanation. It can be pretty damn mind-bending in some cases, but after awhile, when you start thinking this way in regular life, its like some sort of fog has been lifted from your mind.

Sometimes you'll be reading a "fallacy" or "logic error" and think .... What.. The Fuck... sounds good to me why is that an error? Oh.. shit.. i been doing that for 20 years. DOH.

They should teach this stuff as core classes in school. Not as electives, but as grade-school thinking. "how to think" is a hell of a lot more important than memorizing the state capitol of Alabama.

[Sybil]

i feel a touch jipped as far as my education.

things like this should be added to the requirements list..

like you said.. oh man, some of those i have been doing for a very long time.

oops.

but it sunk in quick and a little time every day digging into more thoughtful things and adding a new layer to my onion is an excellent way to fix Me...

well its a start.

thanks for the link..

**sigh**

[Scales]

The first one I get from people I'm close too all the time, lol.

[kat (1)]

This reminds me of my philosophy class I had. It was great.

[pomba gira]

Wow, I missed this one the first time around.

Americans seem to be especially prone to #s 2, 3, 5, 8, 9, and 12... I hear numerous examples of each on an almost daily basis.

Formal logic should definitely be a requirement in schools.

[Homicidalheathen]

ah our wise leader troy

[torn asunder]

people hate it when i'm reasonable, because i usually shoot the hell out of their argument with infallable logic.

what they really mean by "be reasonable" is "stop arguing and agree with me", and i say NEVER!